Used XPS?

[Poly Hive]

https://www.homeconstructionimprovement.com/foam-board-insulation-values/

I have used Extruded Polystrene Foam for various jobs with the bees, though mainly as under timber roof insulation for timber hives.

I know it cuts very neatly so am considering making some nucs with it. I was thinking of lining the inside with 4mm ply or possibly using aluminium foil tape.

Anyone used this already for direct bee contact situations?

PH

 

[Ian123]

Hi In the early days of poly i saw some nucs from 1 supplier made of this stuff and the bees just ate it, so no direct contact it also damages easy. I lined some nucs as you descibe with 6mm ply internaly/bee facing and 3/4 external with the poly as sandwich. As an aside if you are using ply outside then a decent quality harwood wbp and really pile something like sadolin classic on particularly the exposed cut edges

 

[Newbeeneil]

I was toying with the idea of making a long hive with 12mm cedar on the outside, 50mm poly and 3mm ply on the inside so am also interested in any replies.
If you are thinking of sticking the poly to the ply what adhesive would anyone recommend?
When I was involved in the roofing industry many years back you could buy sheets of poly in a thin ply sandwich but was unable to find it recently.

 

[madasafish]

I make 5/6 frame Lang jumbo nucs from Celotex. All joints taped, internal surfaces covered with smooth masonry paint.

Unless you stuff the hive with a surplus of bees (eg queenrearing) bees do not eat walls/floors/roofs. But if you do overfill, expect burrowing - mainly in floors.

 

[Ian123]

I make 5/6 frame Lang jumbo nucs from Celotex. All joints taped, internal surfaces covered with smooth masonry paint.

Unless you stuff the hive with a surplus of bees (eg queenrearing) bees do not eat walls/floors/roofs. But if you do overfill, expect burrowing - mainly in floors.

I am tight all my celotex is off cuts and been banged about a bit, i find once the foil has been peirced then they can start burrowing(sometimes)

 

[madasafish]

I am tight all my celotex is off cuts and been banged about a bit, i find once the foil has been peirced then they can start burrowing(sometimes)

I too am careful with money.. I cover any holes in aluminium foil tape.

PS: I was educated in Aberdeen... a city notorious for the tight fistedness of its denizens..

 

[Ian123]

Re the Aberdeen bit......am surprised you splash out on tape

 

[drex]

Sometimes I use 10cm celotex as a wide dummy board. I coat it with two coats of masonry paint. Bees have not touched the celotex in 3 years of use. I do not even use tape on the cut surfaces.

 

[dpearce4]

Speak to DerekM he is the master of Celotex hives.

 

[Ian123]

Just dont use screws...but in my mind that would lead to ccd.......that would be celotex colapse disorder

 

[Murox]

I was toying with the idea of making a long hive with 12mm cedar on the outside, 50mm poly and 3mm ply on the inside so am also interested in any replies.
If you are thinking of sticking the poly to the ply what adhesive would anyone recommend?
When I was involved in the roofing industry many years back you could buy sheets of poly in a thin ply sandwich but was unable to find it recently.

Two thoughts - 1) adhesive - I think plain wood glue (pva) - takes ages to dry but it will stick poly to wood. Of course if you are building a "sandwich" of wood poly and ply with a framework maybe its not an issue anyway.
2) Use the deepest frames you can, bees will work sideways ok but the habit of going up matters in the overwintering scenario and you need to keep the colony cluster tight.

 

[Millet]

Just dont use screws...but in my mind that would lead to ccd.......that would be celotex colapse disorder

 

[user 6228]

https://www.homeconstructionimprovement.com/foam-board-insulation-values/

I have used Extruded Polystrene Foam for various jobs with the bees, though mainly as under timber roof insulation for timber hives.

I know it cuts very neatly so am considering making some nucs with it. I was thinking of lining the inside with 4mm ply or possibly using aluminium foil tape.

Anyone used this already for direct bee contact situations?

PH

Honeybees are burrowing insects its got to be foil faced without holes or very high density. I have numerous floors were a bit of laziness on the maintenance on my part has later provided a burrowing pastime for others.

 

[Beefriendly]

Honeybees are burrowing insects

You are confusing miner bees (usually solitary) with honey bees, which do not excavate nests.
Your lack of basic bee biology is very worrying.

 

[user 6228]

You are confusing miner bees (usually solitary) with honey bees, which do not excavate nests.
Your lack of basic bee biology is very worrying.

Sorry I have the experimental evidence! and the words of Prof Tom Seeley

"We dissected several unfinished nests and thus observed the intermediate
stages in the preparation of nest cavity wails. When combs only partially filled a cavity, the nest cavity's inner surface was solid and smooth with propolis only around the combs. Lower in the cavity, below the level of the combs, a layer of soft, rotten wood coated the cavity walls. This punkwood lining was up to 20 mm thick. Apparently, before bees build combs they scrape the loose, rotten wood off the walls, thereby exposing firm wood which they then coat with propolis."
1. Seeley TD, Morse RA. 1976 The nest of the honey bee (Apis mellifera L.). Insectes Soc. 23, 495–512. (doi:10.1007/BF02223477)

 

[Hivemaker.]

honey bees, which do not excavate nests.

Of course they do, honey bees bore holes into trees to make their nests, I've seen the holes they make for nesting in.

 

[oliver90owner]

Polyhive Pete,

I think you may mean extruded polyurethane foam, not polystyrene (which is expanded after casting or injection moulded?). Poly U has better insulation properties than EPS.

Or at least most of the posters are referring to poly U, not poly S.

 

[Beefriendly]

. Apparently, before bees build combs they scrape the loose, rotten wood off the walls, thereby exposing firm wood which they then coat with propolis."
(doi:10.1007/BF02223477)

Not really evidence of them being "burrowing insects", more a scrape and clean exercise getting rid of any loose stuff.
If they were miners then you and Seeley both need to explain why they preferentially choose empty boxes vs solid tree trunks?

 

[Beefriendly]

Of course they do, honey bees bore holes into trees to make their nests, I've seen the holes they make for nesting in.

HM, that's woodpeckers.....

 

[madasafish]

Two thoughts - 1) adhesive - I think plain wood glue (pva) - takes ages to dry but it will stick poly to wood. Of course if you are building a "sandwich" of wood poly and ply with a framework maybe its not an issue anyway.
2) Use the deepest frames you can, bees will work sideways ok but the habit of going up matters in the overwintering scenario and you need to keep the colony cluster tight.

5 minute PU glue is best.. see ebay https://tinyurl.com/y4jhhkum.. It foams up so use as little consistent with your cutting skills - great for filling imperfections...

YOU MUST wear gloves and old clothes as PU glue is impossible to remove from clothes and v difficult - and unsightly - on hands..