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BERNIE 

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just wondering what our more experienced beekeepers thought about Ron Hoskins and his super bees.how will the genes of these bees be passed around the country and to every hive? your thoughts please.
 

Hivemaker. 

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how will the genes of these bees be passed around the country and to every hive? your thoughts please.

Simple......they won't be.
 

victor meldrew 

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SUPER BEES?
Wait and see!!.

John Wilkinson
 

MuswellMetro 

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I am not into genetics but if there is a hygenic varroa bee then as a queen mates with about 20 drones then i would have though thats a 1:20 chance that the next supercedure queen will have the hygenic to pass on

thats a bit low unleess you flood the area totally with hygenic varroa drones
 

Hivemaker. 

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hivemaker, please elaborate.

Do i really need to.....do you think that every single hive in the country can be headed by Ron's queens and there genes....and not mate with other strains.
 

jimbeekeeper 

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Anyway what's all the fuss about varroa in managed colonies? It is easily managed, and as for wild / feral they went years ago.
 

oliver90owner 

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and not mate with other strains

Goes right back to Mendel and his peas. Dominant and recessive genes. But it may slowly make a difference as it would be sensible to assume this is not a single-gene trait, if only some groups were dominant in character, what with natural selection and 'survival of the fittest'.

Problem is there will still be far too much genetic interference from those who annually cull queens and import alternative characteristics as their replacements, even if a change for the better was slowly selected.

Regards, RAB
 

Poly Hive 

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Chris B 

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Media reports claim Ron has discovered a grooming bee. What seems more likely is that he's been selecting for this characteristic in a breeding program. Grooming is nothing new but perhaps exagerrating this characteristic has enabled varroa to be kept below the damage for longer.
But is Ron's gene pool big enough? Even if logistical problems could be solved, replacing all the nations bees from this stock would create a massive inbreeding problem - 1 step forward 2 steps back.
 

BERNIE 

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hivemaker, no you really did not have to.but nice to see how people perceive what is being claimed.it seemed to me an impossible task,considering all species need diversity of genes.
 

oliver90owner 

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considering all species need diversity of genes.

'Survival of the fittest for purpose' might mean that eventually all surviving colonies had that very specific gene/trait.


Certainly less genetic diversity if you simply consider that one trait (gene, genes or many genes), but it may mean continuity of the particular evolutionary line. The alternative would be extinction, would it not?

In the case of continuation of the evolutionary line, all the unsuccessful 'variants' would fall by the wayside.

Regards, RAB
 

drstitson 

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there is no need to inbreed to maintain a desired phenotype. You just need to "fix" a phenotype in your stock and then perform the necessary outcrosses and selections when you wish to produce more but on a different genetic background.

This is especially true in bees where haploid males help the situation.

what we need is details as to the inheritance pattern that he has found for the "grooming" phenotype over the time that he has been selecting.
 

RoseCottage 

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If he has succeeded in identifying and selectively breeding Varroa resistant bees, I for one will be grateful. At some point this needs to come about we cannot rely on chemical treatments for ever.

As for breeding, if it can be demonstrated that he has been successful others would rapidly start to follow his selection techniques or using some of his stock to draw the trait out in their own breed lines.

Yes it seems a big statement, probably misunderstood and haphazardly overplayed in the media but wouldn't it be great.
Sam
 

Hivemaker. 

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Become a disciple of the Bispham,follow his teachings and do nothing....and all will be rosy in the garden once again.
 

drstitson 

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serbian paper

C**p methodology and data.

natural mating with no documentation of what drones used.

arbitrary threshold of >=36% damaged mites indicating groomers BUT range between P, F1 and F2 being 31-37%. Unlikely to show true significance given the small numbers selected from each generation (8/80)

Haven't looked in detail at the stats performed but presume won't be valid choice.
 

admin 

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Become a disciple of the Bispham,follow his teachings and do nothing....and all will be rosy in the garden once again.
I have gone rather pale at the very thought of that name !!

Am I right in thinking that Ron may of been importing frozen sperm from Sue Cobey's hygenic Russion strain ?
 

admin 

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Oops,sorry double post,that man has that effect on me.
 
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