Requeening, what's right?

[TwoHiveNovice]

So, I discovered my queen outside the hive yesterday, and worse for ware. Not sure what happened but I did an inspection, no queen cells, everything as should be, so I assume she went out and got caught out by the weather.

I've ordered anew queen. My question being, as I've had contradicting ways of doing this. When I introduce the new queen, do I put the cage in the hive, wait 8 days, check and remove any queen cells and then remove the seal.

OR

Leave her out of the hive before waiting 8 days, remove any signs of queen cells, and THEN put her cage in the hive and leave it a day or two before removing the seal?

Or is none of the above right?

 

[blackcloud]

Make sure there isnt another queen in there
Queen cells means they know they're q/l
Remove them beforehand - are these are their intended queen and they will kill yours.
8 days is after you remove the tab.
You can use masking tape if uncertain.
Check they're not balling the cage.

Second one will end in tears.

There is a third - build a nuc with her then shoehorn into the full size hive once she's laying

Nothing is guaranteed.

 

[smok]

not this time of year queen never go outside for "walk",heen evicted by bees for some reason.
be sure you have no new queen inside hive,
if there is new queen ,than your queen from shop its in danger

 

[TwoHiveNovice]

Make sure there isnt another queen in there
Queen cells means they know they're q/l
Remove them beforehand - are these are their intended queen and they will kill yours.
8 days is after you remove the tab.
You can use masking tape if uncertain.
Check they're not balling the cage.

Second one will end in tears.

There is a third - build a nuc with her then shoehorn into the full size hive once she's laying

Nothing is guaranteed.
[/QUOTEThanks, so I remove the tab as soon as i introduce her to the hive 'AND THEN' check in 8 days for queen cells? Is that what you're saying?

 

[TwoHiveNovice]

not this time of year queen never go outside for "walk",heen evicted by bees for some reason.
be sure you have no new queen inside hive,
if there is new queen ,than your queen from shop its in danger

Thanks for the reply. I have checked. I did a full inspection yesterday. No signs of queens cells, either in the making or hatched. Which is why I found it strange she was outside. They would have started that process before booting her out right?

 

[blackcloud]

Give it another day at least
Have you checked for another queen or fresh eggs?
What became of the old one?

 

[TwoHiveNovice]

Give it another day at least
Have you checked for another queen or fresh eggs?
What became of the old one?

Thanks Blackcloud.

For clarity, on first look I thought she was dead, only when I saw her legs move I put her in a box with some feed and she started to come round a little but wasn't looking great. I have introduced her back to the hive, after a thorough inspection, BUT, I'm not convinced she is in a good way.

I will be checking again tomorrow. BUT have as a backup ordered a new queen with the worst case scenario being that, current queen is indeed good and healthy, I will start a new nuc off with the new queen.

That being said, I honestly do not hold up too much hope, so hence I asked what would be the best way to introduce her. My main question being, IF I introduce her to the hive on Sunday, do I take off the seal or leave the seal on for a week so the hive get used to her AND after a week, take the seal off so she is finally released once the bees eat their way through the fondant?

 

[Erichalfbee]

You hang the cage tab intact between two frames of brood. Leave two/three days then take the tab off if the bees are calm around the cage. Look again one week.
BUT and this is a huge BUT.
I bet you have a queen in there. Your old one has been superseded.
The new queen you but will simply be killed.

 

[TwoHiveNovice]

You hang the cage tab intact between two frames of brood. Leave two/three days then take the tab off if the bees are calm around the cage. Look again one week.
BUT and this is a huge BUT.
I bet you have a queen in there. Your old one has been superseded.
The new queen you but will simply be killed.

Thanks for this @Erichalfbee

The current queen was doing super. She's a new queen (2022 queen) from a six frame nuc and has been laying beautifully. Last week on inspection all was perfect. Not a single sign of queen cells and loads of brood ready to burst, still is and eggs, which makes me think it's purely accidental.

Complete mystery

 

[jenkinsbrynmair]

You hang the cage tab intact between two frames of brood. Leave two/three days then take the tab off if the bees are calm around the cage. Look again one week.
BUT and this is a huge BUT.
I bet you have a queen in there. Your old one has been superseded.
The new queen you but will simply be killed.

just because you never saw a QC doesn't mean there wasn't one
Sometimes bees supersede for what we think is no good reason.
Queens don't just pop out for a bit of fresh air

 

[TwoHiveNovice]

just because you never saw a QC doesn't mean there wasn't one
Sometimes bees supersede for what we think is no good reason.
Queens don't just pop out for a bit of fresh air

@jenkinsbrynmair out of interest (I am new to this) would they boot the queen out without another queen ruling roost?

I have put her back in so in theory IF they booted her out the new queen will do the same again or kill her right?

I'll be checking tomorrow afternoon.

 

[blackcloud]

They would kill her- you will see a massive pile-on her or the cage.
I don't want to muddy the waters as there are more experienced beeks involved now but
your new queen is at great risk until you find out what's going on.

Its a rough stressful process but at worst case you could shake them off into another box through a qx,then inspect each frame all over for any sign of a cell.A hatched queen will not be able to wriggle through the slots easily if at all.

If you can't get to the bottom of this or you find a queen build a nuc ready for the new arrival to reside in at least until things are back on course

 

[Erichalfbee]

Simple thing is to hold your horses for four days. Then look for eggs. If there any then there is a queen in there. I doubt the queen you put back will still be there.

 

[jenkinsbrynmair]

I wouldn't sling a new queen in there until I'd at least tried a test frame to be honest

 

[Antipodes]

Thanks for this @Erichalfbee

The current queen was doing super. She's a new queen (2022 queen) from a six frame nuc and has been laying beautifully. Last week on inspection all was perfect. Not a single sign of queen cells and loads of brood ready to burst, still is and eggs, which makes me think it's purely accidental.

Complete mystery

I was wondering when your last inspection was before you saw the queen outside as they can sometimes (rarely) fall off a frame during colony inspections or a clump of bees fall off the frame (during an inspection) and and dislodge her with them but in either scenario, it is possible for the queen to half fly/fall on the ground, not directly back into the hive. I guess she wouldn't last too long outside however.

 

[Antipodes]

Thanks for the reply. I have checked. I did a full inspection yesterday. No signs of queens cells, either in the making or hatched. Which is why I found it strange she was outside. They would have started that process before booting her out right?

Alternatively, could she be from your other colony? When did you last look in that one?