pagden query

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Cuckmere couple 

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i had a double brood colony which i pagden'd on 09/05/21

today i checked in there and i found what kept happening last year

the flyers had drawn a good number of frames of foundation and the q had laid 4-5 frames of eggs in a week, so very good work

but, there were 6-8 drawn and charged q cells, they were mid frame and in clusters or 2-3 each

i am considering supersedure but still knocked back to 1

last year this happened and in a couple of colonies they then broken them down again

grateful for peoples thoughts, are they hedging their bets or possibly superseding and have i therefore done the correct thing?
 

jenkinsbrynmair 

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i had a double brood colony which i pagden'd on 09/05/21

but, there were 6-8 drawn and charged q cells, they were mid frame and in clusters or 2-3 each

i am considering supersedure
No, they still want to swarm
 

Cuckmere couple 

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so....remove queen into nuc?

i thought pagden was gold standard in artificial swarm ie removing all brood except 1 frame

should i remove q?
 

Finman 

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Somettimes padgen does not work.

When I have had Carniolan bees, they do not often mind about Padgen . They try and try to rear queen cells untill the summer is over.

With Italians I have had proplems.
 
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Cuckmere couple 

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thanks all

Finman, i was struck by a comment from you a long time back about stopping swarming fever

What is the best way of stopping the 'fever' in your mind?
 

Cuckmere couple 

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Could this be a result of intervention done too late?
i guess thats a possibility...i pagden'd as soon as i saw charged q cells

took 9 frames of brood and left one....50% drawn comb and 50% foundation, and then more q cells!
 

elainemary 

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thanks all

Finman, i was struck by a comment from you a long time back about stopping swarming fever

What is the best way of stopping the 'fever' in your mind?
Peter Little (in Steve Donohoe’s book ‘Interviews with beekeepers’) recommends putting the queen into a Nuc. He says if you then take down swarm cells, then take down emergency cells and add another comb with young brood from another colony, to let them make a second batch of emergency cells. Take these down too and swarming fever will have passed and you can reintroduce the queen back from the Nuc. Tried it on a couple of colonies last year and it worked well. A bit more manipulating but it worked. Think quite useful towards the end of the season if you don’t want increase.
I’ve stopped doing Pagdens with any brood left with queen and flying bees as unreliable
 

jenkinsbrynmair 

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took 9 frames of brood and left one....50% drawn comb and 50% foundation,
Ah, that may explain it - with a Pagden you need to give them an empty space - just foundation so they are too busy drawing comb to think about swarming.
 
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Erichalfbee 

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Peter Little (in Steve Donohoe’s book ‘Interviews with beekeepers’) recommends putting the queen into a Nuc. He says if you then take down swarm cells, then take down emergency cells and add another comb with young brood from another colony, to let them make a second batch of emergency cells. Take these down too and swarming fever will have passed and you can reintroduce the queen back from the Nuc. Tried it on a couple of colonies last year and it worked well. A bit more manipulating but it worked. Think quite useful towards the end of the season if you don’t want increase.
I’ve stopped doing Pagdens with any brood left with queen and flying bees as unreliable
Yes Hivemaker ( Pete) has posted that here. I must remember it. Thanks for reminding me
 

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