Open mesh floors in the winter

[blackcloud]

Whch is odd if they supposedly had originated from SE Asia??

 

[Skinfaxi]

Some German beekeepers say bees warm the brood not the box.

 

[The Poot]

I’m struggling to find the references, but wasn’t there some research that a humid atmosphere in the hive is good for bees but bad for varroa?

Its a marketing point for Zest hives, which apparently maintain a humid state. According to my SBI it’s not really effective against varroa though.

 

[madasafish]

I run a mix of solid and mesh floors.
Leave varroa boards in winter.
Hives are on stands: we get a lot of cold winter winds.
Testing two hives in early days showed closed floors gave faster Spring build up.
Summer heat? all insulated: no apparent difference.

Others may find differently.

 

[B_north]

Nectar, humidity, honey bees ( Apis mellifera) and varroa in summer: a theoretical thermofluid analysis of the fate of water vapour from honey ripening and its implications on the control of Varroa destructor - PubMed

 

[jenkinsbrynmair]

*Theoretical*

 

[Goran]

Some German beekeepers say bees warm the brood not the box.

We are not Germans, but we learnt also that bees warm the brood/cluster not box.. I think it is more relied upon Russian school.. Take the strong colony ( cleaned from varroa and nosema), enough stores, only roof on top, mesh wire on sides ( to prevent from predators) and I would bet that it will survive and thrive in spring.. Bees are wonder..

 

[JamezF]

We are not Germans, but we learnt also that bees warm the brood/cluster not box

That's my understanding too. Heat being what it is though, the end effect will be that the box also gets warmed. Entropy always wins.

James

 

[robmort]

Anyone who says "...that's a fact" is a liar.

 

[user 20297]

Anyone who says "...that's a fact" is a liar

....and that's a fact.

 

[B_north]

*Theoretical*

Absolutely theoretical. I was offering it up for the following poster

I’m struggling to find the references, but wasn’t there some research that a humid atmosphere in the hive is good for bees but bad for varroa?

 

[B_north]

Take the strong colony ( cleaned from varroa and nosema), enough stores, only roof on top, mesh wire on sides ( to prevent from predators) and I would bet that it will survive and thrive in spring.. Bees are wonder..

I bet you might be right. We had -40C winter and a swarm of bees in a draughty unheated plank shed wall 3/4" thick with gaps, no upper insulation let alone side wall insulation, multiple entrances both upper and lower, and it survived until March 4th when it succumbed to starvation or mites.

 

[JamezF]

*Theoretical*

I really don't have a problem with this. It's part of the scientific method. Given a set of data and an understanding of relevant science the authors are making a prediction about how things should play out. What's required next is to test that hypothesis and refine the science based on the results. If the results are consistent with the predictions then it increases our confidence in the science, if they're inconsistent then clearly there's some inadequacy that needs fixing and if it does neither then there's a need for further refinement of the hypothesis or the testing. That's just how science adds to our body of knowledge about any subject.

So the paper doesn't say "this is how it is", but rather "given our current understanding, this is how we would expect it to be".

Possibly relevant here is an understanding of what is meant by "theory" or "theoretical" because they can mean different things depending on context. Scientifically speaking, "theory" (and therefore "theoretical") refers to a model that is considered correct and consistent (for example the Theory of Evolution). In non-scientific language, a "theory" may be something as yet unproven (which a scientist might refer to as a hypothesis).

In this specific instance I believe the testing work has already been done, but at the moment I can't recall where I read the results which is exceptionally irritating.

James

 

[Gilberdyke John]

I’m struggling to find the references, but wasn’t there some research that a humid atmosphere in the hive is good for bees but bad for varroa?

I'm pretty sure it was mentioned in Derek Mitchell's paperwork

 

[pargyle]

*TheoretiCAL

Not that theoretical ...

"According to the article, mite reproduction drops significantly when the relative humidity is high. In one study (Kraus and Velthuis, 1997) at 59-68% relative humidity, 53% of mites produced offspring, whereas at 79-85% relative humidity only 2% of the mites produced offspring."

 

[Garry R]

Does this beg the question - "Are poly hives better at preventing varroa reproduction due to humidity in the hive?" The insulating properties lead to higher overall temperatures but unlike wooden hives there is less condensation in the cold spots but due to the insulating properties of polystyrene the humidity should be higher. Anyone with a view on this?

 

[deemann1]

I tried a little experiment last winter
All my hives (50) are on stands with OMF
I left the inspection tray in full on half my colonies and had no inspection tray on the other half
There was no difference on the colonies come spring i had no winter losses apart from 4 nucs

 

[Sutty]

I tried a little experiment last winter
All my hives (50) are on stands with OMF
I left the inspection tray in full on half my colonies and had no inspection tray on the other half
There was no difference on the colonies come spring i had no winter losses apart from 4 nucs

Are you in a windy or sheltered spot?

 

[deemann1]

Are you in a windy or sheltered spot?

7 different locations

 

[madasafish]

Does this beg the question - "Are poly hives better at preventing varroa reproduction due to humidity in the hive?" The insulating properties lead to higher overall temperatures but unlike wooden hives there is less condensation in the cold spots but due to the insulating properties of polystyrene the humidity should be higher. Anyone with a view on this?

Well ALL my hives have been insulated or are poly and have been since 2017 and my mites drops are very low (yes I know it's an unreliable guide). Very few DWV bees seen

Now I treat twice a year - August NOT OA and December vaped OA and have done since 2017.
SO my conclusions are:
either my bees are resistant to mites
or
my treatment regime is brilliant
or my beekeeping is of a superior quality
or
my location is great for low mite levels

Now despite what some people say , it is factual that even treated bees have some degree of resistance.

SO my conclusion- naturally - is I am a great beekeeper but as my honey yields are not earth shattering nor my Q rearing great I must be wrong.. sadly.

SO it must be down to humidity. (my hives are humid but little internal condensation and no mouldy combs