Nosema

[Newbeeneil]

Found a hive that had died out today. Still plenty of stores, mass of dead bees on floor and a few dead on the frames.
There were several flecks of bee poo across the tops of the frames and some down the side of the box.
I'm of a mind not to use the frames again but am I over reacting?

 

[Ian123]

You can get 20 times worse than that, but I am never inclined to use frames from any dead colony. But I have a decent wax melter and cheap frames. So pays your money and take the choice. Acetic acid at the very least, personally I would not bother. Ian

 

[ericbeaumont]

Found a hive that had died out today. I'm of a mind not to use the frames again but am I over reacting?

Go with your instinct and Ian's advice and get rid of them, Neil. The honey (if it is honey) would be OK to extract but unless you know that the cause of death is harmless (queen failure, for example) best not risk it for a few quid.

 

[pargyle]

That's not a lot of bee poo .. Usually lots more with a serious case of Nosema. There could be just a case of 'normal' winter dysentery - the bees can't get out to defacate and some gets left in the hive. A colony can die out for a variety of reasons ..

If you have a microscope you might want to check some dead bees for Nosema spores before you dump the brood frames - valuable commodity drawn frames and sometimes people seem far too quick to dispose of them.

It is possible to save the frames and comb with heat treatment ... even if there was Nosema.

https://www.honeybeesuite.com/how-to-clean-up-from-nosema-apis/

 

[drex]

As per Pargyle, bee poo inside the hives, is usually an indicator of dysentery.
Dysentery often caused by the wrong sort of stores e.g. A lot of granulated honey.
DYSENTERY DOES NOT EQUAL A DIAGNOSIS OF NOSEMA
Only way to find out is by microscope of a smear of the poo.
Acetic acid does kill Nosema spores

 

[Newbeeneil]

https://www.honeybeesuite.com/how-to-clean-up-from-nosema-apis/

Thanks Philip,
I used the above once before but had forgotten about it. I recently knocked up a honey super warmer based on 500watt fan heater which should be able to heat up to 60c easily but it might be safer to stick with 49c over 24hrs.

 

[pargyle]

Thanks Philip,
I used the above once before but had forgotten about it. I recently knocked up a honey super warmer based on 500watt fan heater which should be able to heat up to 60c easily but it might be safer to stick with 49c over 24hrs.

Yes .. the 60 degrees is a bit too close to 63 degrees wax melting point - I'd go with the lower and longer option as well. P

 

[Beefriendly]

DYSENTERY DOES NOT EQUAL A DIAGNOSIS OF NOSEMA
Only way to find out is by microscope of a smear of the poo.
Acetic acid does kill Nosema spores

Spot on. I've just analysed the gut contents of 30 bees from a hive that had poo on the frames. Clean as a whistle, struggled to identify anything that resembled a nosema spore.
As this hive has what I think is an unmated virgin queen, I can now happily throw them out to join other hives when we next get some decent flying weather (minus virgin queen of course).

 

[Madge]

It is possible to save the frames and comb with heat treatment ... even if there was Nosema.

https://www.honeybeesuite.com/how-to-clean-up-from-nosema-apis/

I know, Pargyle’s link is about the heat treatment of combs - but she also mentions Fumidil-B as colony treatment, and that’s not allwed in the UK. I thought I’ll mention it just in case ...

 

[pargyle]

[QUOTE I know, Pargyle’s link is about the heat treatment of combs - but she also mentions Fumidil-B as colony treatment, and that’s not allwed in the UK. I thought I’ll mention it just in case ...]

Quite right ... I don't think you can even buy Fumidil B in Europe .. banned several years ago. Still available and I understand used in the USA.

 

[Newbeeneil]

Heat treated the broodbox and combs with a temperature of 60decC in my super warmer. It took about 30 mins to heat to the required temperature and it had no trouble maintaining it for 15 mins.