Fascinating research, I knew I had read something like this a couple of years ago and have been trying to find it since I heard a webinar about further research which supported it!
Andrew Abrahams doesn't seem to have lost any *** alleles (the clearest measure of inbreeding suppression in bees)in his bees since they started being sampled for such things, that's with only a hundred or so colonies stuck on colonsay and oransay over a few decades, and he describes his bees as the most poked about bees by scientists in the world.
Read back, he quoted the most recent census, about as clear and unequivocal an answer as is possible with such a question.
This is overly aggressive nonsense, unless I've missed it at no point is Lislarybees trying to tell beekeepers in England or Wales what to keep.
A bit much to expect him to confirm by personal correspondence with each beekeeper imho
I had numerous phone conversations with Pete about his Amm, it was very interesting. They worked the same way as their Buckfast, no veil, gloves. He had some French queens too but they were'different', last thing he told me was the resistance was crumbling
I had numerous phone conversations with Pete about his Amm, it was very interesting. They worked the same way as their Buckfast, no veil, gloves. He had some French queens too but they were'different', last thing he told me was the resistance was crumbling
Ceri has sweet natured bees and Jon's are similarly gentle.
Unless people are made aware of this, we will forever hear those novice beekeepers who bought their first nuc last year, telling other new beekeepers that "black bees are nasty bees".
I've encouraged other beekeepers to try them and assess their behaviour for themselves. I've yet to have a negative report, in fact, most can't believe how calm they are.
The difficulty is getting that message across.
completely agree with what your saying swarm, if you choose where your getting your black bees from and preferably those that have been improving them for a while your not going to get aggressive or defensive behaviour because by an large the said breeder is on the ball and producing good quality stock.
Yes, Colonsay bees have been “isolated” for a fair amount of time and were already a pretty stable “closed” population. I should have thought predicting the susceptibility of specific populations to inbreeding depression would be rather difficult owing to the large element of chance involved with inbreeding depression. Perhaps slow rates of “inbreeding” or restricted breeding over a long period of time has the potential to reduce inbreeding depression. Ireland's bees will have been exposed to significantly more influences than Colonsay's ever before it stops importation.
I have one hive of Jon Getty bees and they are very good natured and long suffering. I have yet to receive a sting or any sign of aggression from them. Given half decent forage they will produce a decent enough (for me) return in honey. This year (year 1) that hive produced 20kg surplus on rubbish forage in frankly not good weather, and they did that pretty much in the one month (July) of decent weather.I had numerous phone conversations with Pete about his Amm, it was very interesting. They worked the same way as their Buckfast, no veil, gloves. He had some French queens too but they were'different', last thing he told me was the resistance was crumbling
Ceri has sweet natured bees and Jon's are similarly gentle.
Unless people are made aware of this, we will forever hear those novice beekeepers who bought their first nuc last year, telling other new beekeepers that "black bees are nasty bees".
I've encouraged other beekeepers to try them and assess their behaviour for themselves. I've yet to have a negative report, in fact, most can't believe how calm they are.
The difficulty is getting that message across.
I have no doubt that the local bee breeders in Ireland can produce good tempered bees. My point was that the source material is not genetically pure in the first place. it is not a true breed and hasn't been for many decades / centuries because of previous importation. Near native is not native, and i see no scientific evidence that a distinctive indigenous bee species survives in Ireland in a genetically pure form.
I have two of Ceri’s queens. I’m really looking forward to working with them too but I’m sure he doesn’t sell them as Amm. You can have great bees that are not Amm
I would rather buy stock from folk like this.
I have some of @mbc queen's which have superseded 2019 and still have all the qualities I desire, I hope one day I can rear stock as such, but only from being rigorous and selecting will I ever get there.
I wish. I’ve tried four times and each time the bees let the new queen lay then nobbled her and raised their own. The daughters were ok but that’s not what I’d been after. Hey ho. Can’t win them all
If you mean me then I think my comment a valid point. I’d have said the same about any other grey or orange. There are a heck of a lot of people selling black bees as Amm just as there are those selling Buckfast hybrids that turn out awful.
