Nat V’s Commercial

[wightbees]

I have been thinking of moving over to Commercial hives from National but something just occurred to me. More often than not I use double Deep box’s for brood. But not all of it gets brood and I would guess in the top box I have on average 3 or 4 frames of honey . So moving over to commercial I’m guessing that I’m going to have honey that I’m not going to be able to use without messing around moving frames. Or have I got this wrong ?

 

[PeaBee]

I run both nats and commercial. Pros and cons to each. I like the flexibility to do demaree, and other manipulations such as vertical splits more easily in nationals but the extra volume of commercial is handy with expansive queens and can make for quicker inspections compared with double brood nationals.
Having taken both types to the heather this year I do find the nationals more productive precisely for the reason you mentioned ( I suppose they are equally productive but nationals are more easily harvested). As the brood nest shrank a considerable amount of honey was stored in deep commercial frames in the brood box. On average probably getting on for at least a supers worth compared to the nationals on the same sites
Not found this an issue with spring (osr) flows or summer flows, but was very noticeable this year in September. Other than that both have merits and I will continue with both for now.

 

[mbc]

I'm getting out of commercials in favour of nationals, mainly for simplifying equipment down to one format but also, as mentioned, you get more honey in your supers with nationals in all but the most protracted flows, with my native bees around here anyway.
I'll still run the commercials until they come to a natural end but it's been a time wasting dalliance mostly, quite recently I tried a few of the Maisemore poly comms just to see but they only served to confirm my original misgivings, more honey from my nationals plus they're easier to take nucs from.
I find commercial nucs have to be disproportionately well stocked so the little colonies can keep connected around the big area of frame

 

[ericbeaumont]

thinking of moving over to Commercial hives from National

What persuaded you to consider the change?

 

[Foxylad]

I run commercial hives, local mongrels take a while to get going. My buckfast queens fill the box.
For me the space and not running brood and a half, double brood. Makes my time more efficient.
If your selling nucs nationals are the way to go.
If you look at the frame dimensions there’s not a lot in it.

 

[wightbees]

Thank you all for your input , it has reinforced my thinking really.
The reason I was/am considering the change is I thought it would make things quicker for me. Building boxes right through to inspections would be far easier. But the loss of that honey would be to great on a larger scale .
I might use commercial suppers as that would help on the diy front. Or I could try Hamilton converter on a few boxes to see how it pans out .
Choices lol

 

[rolande]

might use commercial suppers as that would help on the diy front.

Ive said this so many times before and quite often been told, basically, that it's nonsense but having used a lot of commercials in the past (we eventually concentrated on md's) I wouldn't hesitate to use commercial supers on nationals if I was starting again with nats. Maybe I'd use all one size national deeps, if not then it would deeps for brood and commercial supers for honey. No doubt in my mind, the 16X6 frame is the best bit of the commercial hive.

 

[wightbees]

(we eventually concentrated on md's)

Do you Dadant here ?

 

[rolande]

Yes, mo

Do you Dadant here ?

Yes, modified dadant. We simply had the opportunity to buy a lot at a good price and took it from there.

 

[wightbees]

Unfortunately I have lots of National boxes so I’m trying to make the best of it . I’m definitely moving over to commercial suppers though. More honey to a box and easier to build the box are my reasons.
Your Mds set up, is it all medium boxes you are using ? I generally intended to go that route when I first start but with one thing and another ended up with Nats !!

 

[rolande]

Unfortunately I have lots of National boxes so I’m trying to make the best of it . I’m definitely moving over to commercial suppers though. More honey to a box and easier to build the box are my reasons.
Your Mds set up, is it all medium boxes you are using ? I generally intended to go that route when I first start but with one thing and another ended up with Nats !!

No we use deep md broods (and have 13 frame bs broods which are interchangeable) and standard md supers. We have ran all shallow stacks on occasion and they're quite nice to work in many ways.

 

[wightbees]

One size makes perfect sense to me but I’m now stuck with what I have. Maybe if I’m luckily enough to ever come across a good deal I will change.
Cheers
WB

 

[PeaBee]

Totally agree with comments about commercial supers. I find them far easier to work with (and make) compared to national ones. I dont use any national shallows any more and use either national deeps or commercial shallows as supers.

 

[Poly Hive]

If there are brood combs full of honey and you want it in the supers and the brood frames full of brood use your hive tool. Simple.

PH

 

[BigAshW]

I started on commercial kit as that's what my mentor ran so I worked with what he had. Now though it seems hard to get commercial kit at a sensible price so I'm considering changing formats.

 

[wightbees]

If there are brood combs full of honey and you want it in the supers and the brood frames full of brood use your hive tool. Simple.

PH

During the beginning of the year I do this.

 

[Boston Bees]

During the beginning of the year I do this.

Do what, exactly?

 

[user 20297]

Do what, exactly?

....scratches the cappings of broodbox stores expecting the bees to take it upwards? If that does work, it can't be good if the bees have been fed any form of sugar since the combs were all last renewed.