Italian beeks proverb

Beekeeping & Apiculture Forum

Help Support Beekeeping & Apiculture Forum:

drstitson 

Queen Bee
Joined
Aug 4, 2010
Messages
7,655
Reaction score
2
Location
surrey, lincolnshire etc.
Hive Type
dadant
Number of Hives
14
have just been browsing recent posts on http://apicoltura.mastertopforum.net/
and came across the following in a thread about transparent crownboards.

Come dice il proverbio: quando il glomere va in sù, mile non ce n'è più.

or

As the proverb says: when the cluster goes up, it's gone (literally "it's not there anymore")

Anyone aware of an English equivalent???
 

Poly Hive 

Queen Bee
Joined
Dec 4, 2008
Messages
13,717
Reaction score
61
Location
Scottish Borders
Hive Type
national
Number of Hives
12 and 18 Nucs
In a word no.

Nor is it true for insulated colonies.

PH
 

drstitson 

Queen Bee
Joined
Aug 4, 2010
Messages
7,655
Reaction score
2
Location
surrey, lincolnshire etc.
Hive Type
dadant
Number of Hives
14
PH

"Nor is it true for insulated colonies."

Interesting point PH - apart from the odd poly swarm boxes Italy is still firmly set on wooden hives (pine not cedar) despite the fact that many hives are located in alpine climates.

However, unlike UK wooden hives are still cheap - it's possible to get flatpack 10 frame DB hives for £35-40 inc VAT (http://www.casagrandecuppoloni.it/pdf/OFFERTA_APICOLTURA_SETTEMBRE.pdf)
 

Poly Hive 

Queen Bee
Joined
Dec 4, 2008
Messages
13,717
Reaction score
61
Location
Scottish Borders
Hive Type
national
Number of Hives
12 and 18 Nucs
It was clear it related to timber boxes. Given that it would be true. (sadly)

PH
 

victor meldrew 

Queen Bee
Joined
Nov 10, 2008
Messages
6,747
Reaction score
273
Location
Wigan
Hive Type
14x12
Number of Hives
6
Maybe a translation thing ?
Cluster could relate to swarm?

John Wilkinson
 

drstitson 

Queen Bee
Joined
Aug 4, 2010
Messages
7,655
Reaction score
2
Location
surrey, lincolnshire etc.
Hive Type
dadant
Number of Hives
14
re providers

it'd be interesting to see what sort of response there'd be for a paid for provider amongst the italian beeks - the amount of traffic/users doesn't appear to be anything like BKF.

despite the lack of traffic there are some interesting snippets to tickle the funny bone - one newish beek was looking to acquire a few hives and had opportunity to piggyback on a colleagues' order & get bulk pricing BUT was concerned that the DBs would have to be the "stanziale" type (without porch, like various UK hives) rather than more common "nomadissmo" type with porch. He was concerned about rain/snow getting in!!!!! I just don't know how any of our UK bees survive in our rain sodden countryside without the benefit of porches!!!!
 

Black Comb 

Queen Bee
Joined
Aug 10, 2009
Messages
2,737
Reaction score
1
Location
Cumbria
Hive Type
other
Number of Hives
10+
Is this anything to do with the idea that when the cluster is on top of the frames it means they have no food left?

I'm sure I've read this somewhere but can't find the reference.
 

drstitson 

Queen Bee
Joined
Aug 4, 2010
Messages
7,655
Reaction score
2
Location
surrey, lincolnshire etc.
Hive Type
dadant
Number of Hives
14
a little clarification

"Maybe a translation thing ?
Cluster could relate to swarm?"

John - No definitely cluster, not swarm (sciarme)

firstly, a typo in the original quote, which alters things a little:

"quando il glomere va in sù, miEle non ce n'è più."

which gives:

"when the cluster goes up, the honey's gone."

The OP has clarified for me:

Based on what I was able to experience (a little) and read (a little), the cluster doesn't occupy capped honey. Since honey is stored at the top of the frames as well as on the sides, the cluster is below the area where there is honey. Logically the first honey to be consumed is close to the cluster and as it is consumed the cluster head up to occupy the area that is cleared (because theoretically it should be better under the roof than down on the frames, at least I think). So when the cluster rises it may mean that the honey in the upper part is less and less.
 

Poly Hive 

Queen Bee
Joined
Dec 4, 2008
Messages
13,717
Reaction score
61
Location
Scottish Borders
Hive Type
national
Number of Hives
12 and 18 Nucs
""Maybe a translation thing ?
Cluster could relate to swarm?"

John - No definitely cluster, not swarm (sciarme)

firstly, a typo in the original quote, which alters things a little:

"quando il glomere va in sù, miEle non ce n'è più."

which gives:

"when the cluster goes up, the honey's gone."

The OP has clarified for me:

Based on what I was able to experience (a little) and read (a little), the cluster doesn't occupy capped honey. Since honey is stored at the top of the frames as well as on the sides, the cluster is below the area where there is honey. Logically the first honey to be consumed is close to the cluster and as it is consumed the cluster head up to occupy the area that is cleared (because theoretically it should be better under the roof than down on the frames, at least I think). So when the cluster rises it may mean that the honey in the upper part is less and less."

Ok so translates if your bees are on the top bars they are fu****. Simple. I tried to say this more gently earlier. If they are on the top bars they are starving... Simple

PH
 

Hivemaker. 

Queen Bee
Beekeeping Sponsor
Joined
Nov 8, 2008
Messages
14,286
Reaction score
14
Location
Exmoor.
Hive Type
national
Simply not true that when the bee's are on top of the frames they have no food left.... fiction.
 

Dishmop 

Queen Bee
BeeKeeping Supporter
Joined
May 29, 2010
Messages
6,213
Reaction score
0
Location
Norwich
Hive Type
national
Number of Hives
3 National Hives & 1 Observation Hive.(Indoors) & lots of empty boxes..
Based on what I was able to experience (a little) and read (a little), the cluster doesn't occupy capped honey. Since honey is stored at the top of the frames as well as on the sides, the cluster is below the area where there is honey. Logically the first honey to be consumed is close to the cluster and as it is consumed the cluster head up to occupy the area that is cleared (because theoretically it should be better under the roof than down on the frames, at least I think). So when the cluster rises it may mean that the honey in the upper part is less and less.
That is the same conclusion that I have come to after reading and watching.

The Warre hive is supposed to work that you add extra boxes below and the queen goes downwards and the cells left empty by emerging bees are then filled with honey, and thus it goes on,,, then when winter comes the cluster moves back upwards eating the food on the way up, which is really no different to what happens in a normal hive. So theroretically when they get to the top they might have eaten everything on the way.


Also read that bees dont walk about on capped stores because its had work and requires more energy.
Watching my observation hive at the moment there are bees feeding on the upper frames but the only ones on those frames that are moving with any purpose are on the outer edges of the frame where this are no stores.
 

Hivemaker. 

Queen Bee
Beekeeping Sponsor
Joined
Nov 8, 2008
Messages
14,286
Reaction score
14
Location
Exmoor.
Hive Type
national
And from my observations,even now in this cold, i have bee's in five frame nuc's, and some full size colonys, that are on top the crown board,and even clustered under the roof,so are obviously all over the top bars as well,yet they are full of stores.

Dishmop,where did you read that bee's don't walk around on capped stores,because its hard work....just out of interest.
 
Last edited:

drstitson 

Queen Bee
Joined
Aug 4, 2010
Messages
7,655
Reaction score
2
Location
surrey, lincolnshire etc.
Hive Type
dadant
Number of Hives
14
"Dishmop,where did you read that bee's don't walk around on capped stores,because its hard work....just out of interest."

i'd have thought that sticky uncapped stores (or balancing on cell walls only) was harder work.
 

Dishmop 

Queen Bee
BeeKeeping Supporter
Joined
May 29, 2010
Messages
6,213
Reaction score
0
Location
Norwich
Hive Type
national
Number of Hives
3 National Hives & 1 Observation Hive.(Indoors) & lots of empty boxes..
And from my observations,even now in this cold, i have bee's in five frame nuc's, and some full size colonys, that are on top the crown board,and even clustered under the roof,so are obviously all over the top bars as well,yet they are full of stores.

Dishmop,where did you read that bee's don't walk around on capped stores,because its hard work....just out of interest.
I cant disagree with what you say because I havent seen it but my thoughts, although not really based on any experience, is that ... if you have been feeding them fondant (?) might they not be there waiting for some more? If you havent been giving them fondant that then shows that my thoughts are wrong. Stand at the back of the class.

Walking on capped stores.........? I think it might have been in the Urban Beekeeping book.
 

Black Comb 

Queen Bee
Joined
Aug 10, 2009
Messages
2,737
Reaction score
1
Location
Cumbria
Hive Type
other
Number of Hives
10+
Found it. Page 2 of Dec edition of BB A News - "In The Apiary"

"...... if the bee cluster is at the top of the frames it indicates a shortage of stores and emergency feeding using "candy" is required."
 

Mike a 

Drone Bee
Joined
Feb 13, 2010
Messages
1,785
Reaction score
1
Location
Hampshire
Hive Type
langstroth
Number of Hives
Between 17-20
I cant disagree with what you say because I havent seen it but my thoughts, although not really based on any experience, is that ... if you have been feeding them fondant (?) might they not be there waiting for some more? If you havent been giving them fondant that then shows that my thoughts are wrong. Stand at the back of the class.

Walking on capped stores.........? I think it might have been in the Urban Beekeeping book.
 

Dishmop 

Queen Bee
BeeKeeping Supporter
Joined
May 29, 2010
Messages
6,213
Reaction score
0
Location
Norwich
Hive Type
national
Number of Hives
3 National Hives & 1 Observation Hive.(Indoors) & lots of empty boxes..
Found it. Page 2 of Dec edition of BB A News - "In The Apiary"

"...... if the bee cluster is at the top of the frames it indicates a shortage of stores and emergency feeding using "candy" is required."
but that doesnt tally with what was said about bees at top and frames full of stores...

These bloody bees should have learned by now to follow the rules...bee-smillie
 

Dishmop 

Queen Bee
BeeKeeping Supporter
Joined
May 29, 2010
Messages
6,213
Reaction score
0
Location
Norwich
Hive Type
national
Number of Hives
3 National Hives & 1 Observation Hive.(Indoors) & lots of empty boxes..
More?

You want more?
 

Hivemaker. 

Queen Bee
Beekeeping Sponsor
Joined
Nov 8, 2008
Messages
14,286
Reaction score
14
Location
Exmoor.
Hive Type
national
Found it. Page 2 of Dec edition of BB A News - "In The Apiary"

"...... if the bee cluster is at the top of the frames it indicates a shortage of stores and emergency feeding using "candy" is required."
Better rush out and feed them fondant then,and they can leave all the full combs of stores to congest them up in spring.
 

Latest posts

Top