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Now I understand better the hobby beekeeping business in UK.

Compared to Finland or Sweden

- Poly hive double price
- frame 2-3 fold higher
- winter food double price

- you bye 6% oxalic acid from Italy because your own made 3% is out of law


and you are proud about it. ... Goooood business to some.
 
pro beekeeping like the rest of agriculture is a production industry.

UK economy doesn't like production.

GDP it seems depends upon predominantly consumption (of either cheap imported cr*p OR overpriced imported cr*p) or supposed service "industries".

Uk service to consumers - non existent unless we employ foreigners.
UK financial service industry - served us all so well by fuelling the practices that caused the crash.

and of course we don't have EU and government subsidies.
 
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A hint....

Frames are not made in Finland. They are in Estonia.
I bet that Swedish are made too in Estonia or in Latvia, but surely in some cheap country.

You must control the wood quality, absolutely.

It is really strange that your frames are more expencive than the box.
Frames are easy to make you self and for free.

Nowadays Russia is the biggest wood seller in Europe. Bye board from there.
 
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Ookay....

I looked our biggest deliverers catalogue about bee forage

ambrosia 1,6 euro a kilo

67% sudar syrup, delivered with tank truck, 1,6 euro a sugar kilo

Lidl sugar 0,8 euro a kilo

and the advantage is in douple price - nothing

I am sure that Estonians do not bye 3-fold price sugar. They have not money.
Tens of thousands have moved just now to work to Finland because they have not work places there.


Bees do not understand about brands. Sugar is sugar.

.

Ok so your real objection to inverted sugar syrup is based on price it apears?

I find that its easy enough to make at home rather than buy it in. But if i had more than 10 hives i would be buying it in rather than making it
 
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When I bye sugar 600 kg in Autumn, you recommend tat is it better to pay 960 euros than 480 euros. What would yu do with 480 euros?

And cant you understand, nothing inversion is needed.


But you do as you like.

I learner here that syrup making is easy in loundry machine. Since then I have used it.

But actually Lidl have noticed that sugar selling goes up every September. So it rises the price from 80 cent to 90 cent.
 
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Prove it......

It is much more easier when I admit that I cannot win 5 hive owner in debating.

My limit was 2 hive owner before, but it is now 5 hives . I am a bad looser.:cool:


ääääähhhhhhhrrrr
 
i wonder about you information source. These two countries have a economic level 1/5 that of Finland, or lower.

Because I arranged some of it!

Some full loads loads went to Lithuania, where they have a lot of direct beekeeping connections with Denmark, and one went on up into Estonia. And your prices are all to hell. Someone is screwing you (if you were buying it that is!).

GBP 545 per tonne delivered, all made up ready to go. A bit more expensive in the UK due to ferry charges, maybe the same for Finland sadly, but not over 650/tonne. At the time this was about 740 euros. Plus its 72% sugars, and Ambrosia is the most overpriced product in the range, way out the top of the price bracket for what it is. I just helped a friend in England this week to buy a load, and he had Ambrosia in Septemebr but has bought an identical product, Invert bee, and saved GBP5000 (yes, five thousand) on ONE truckload.

It is more expensive yes, but not dramatically so, and sorry, but it IS the best autumn food I have ever encountered. Superior to white sugar syrup without a shadow of doubt. If it were not, trust me, I would not be buying it.
 
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I am having to stick to Tesco's sugar... simply because I can not get an IBC on the carrier on my bat bike... and could not afford to buy in such a vast quantity!

Even a return trip to Tesco is now costing me £1.44 in diesel!
 
B

It is more expensive yes, but not dramatically so, and sorry, but it IS the best autumn food I have ever encountered. Superior to white sugar syrup without a shadow of doubt. If it were not, trust me, I would not be buying it.

i do not know because I have wintered 50 years hives with white sugar syrup.
And so have done others. I exctract allmost all honey away from hives.

Our winter is bad because it is long. In insulated hives cold is not bad. I do not need beehouses or wintering cellars.

I do not live in cold area in our scale. It is ten miles to he sea. Winters are not bad to bees. It goes with routine.

Of course I believe you. In the business scale what you are running, you have not afford to mistakes.

But it is not my habit to kill hives.
 
GBP 545 per tonne delivered, all made up ready to go. A bit more expensive in the UK due to ferry charges, maybe the same for Finland sadly, but not over 650/tonne. At the time this was about 740 euros. Plus its 72% sugars, and Ambrosia is the most overpriced product in the range, way out the top of the price bracket for what it is. I just helped a friend in England this week to buy a load, and he had Ambrosia in Septemebr but has bought an identical product, Invert bee, and saved GBP5000 (yes, five thousand) on ONE truckload.

It is more expensive yes, but not dramatically so, and sorry, but it IS the best autumn food I have ever encountered. Superior to white sugar syrup without a shadow of doubt. If it were not, trust me, I would not be buying it.

A problem encountered here is that beekeepers with 00s or 000s of hives are cornering the market.

In simple terms, the Apisuc/Ambrosia/etc phone rings and a voice says "I'd like to be a dealer and I'll buy a load of stuff.

OK, says Apisuc/Ambrosia/etc and a load is sent over.

Problem is, that load is for personal use, NOT for distribution or onward selling (other than a select group of friends), as was agreed with Apisuc/Ambrosia/etc.

When the small beekeeper, or other who genuinely wants to supply ready-made syrup (or hives) rings Apisuc/Ambrosia/etc (or hive suppliers) he's told "Trouble is Sir, we have people in the UK who phone and say they want to supply our products but they only keep them for themselves and don't expand the business. I was told the same by a well-known hive supplier.

Small scale beekeeper is told by "alleged supplier in UK" "Well, yeah, but it's gonna cost double and more for it to be supplied. We only use it for our bees and just had 5/6/ or so tons in. Don't really want to be bothered supplying a tonne here and there 'cos we're busy."

In two instances, Apisuc was substantially more expensive than Ambrosia from "alleged UK suppliers" who were too busy to supply in any event.

I believe this forum is principally for the smaller beekeeper who is happy to club together with his fellow man or woman and buy products in bulk when warranted.

With this in mind, when beekeepers with numerous hives, who are able to use bulk purchasing to reduce the price for themselves (and in some cases, foul the market for the small enterprise as a result).

It would be more helpful if they said where the smaller enterprise, the majority on here were told 'It can be bought here and here for approx £? AND it's cheap of course :)

Reading the type of rhetoric that is starting to abound is narrowing the field and a lot like listening to the bonuses bankers are receiving, those quantities mean nothing to the smaller enterprise.

This isn't aimed at you, I have no knowledge of what you do other than you have a lot of hives and reading the odd post of yours.

The above are all facts from the situations that have been encountered by us.
 
BBG, In scenarios such as that which you have outlined, 'small' beekeepers just need to group together to make a purchase of the ambrosia/apisuc etc. It has been done on this forum in terms of the purchase of foundation.
I have placed group orders for foundation in 2011 and my 2012 order was over £2300.00. I am looking into purchasing invert syrup and fondant during 2012 for a group of people in Ireland (North and South - we have a wee 'delivery network') but am currently waiting for the UK wholesaler to get back to me with apisuc prices. The annoying thing is that some people will not even give a tentative estimate of what they might buy until I get a price and the wholesaler won't give a price until i have a firm indication of the quantity I want to purchase and so it goes on.... I'll get it sorted one of these days!
 
BBG, In scenarios such as that which you have outlined, 'small' beekeepers just need to group together to make a purchase of the ambrosia/apisuc etc. It has been done on this forum in terms of the purchase of foundation.
I have placed group orders for foundation in 2011 and my 2012 order was over £2300.00. I am looking into purchasing invert syrup and fondant during 2012 for a group of people in Ireland (North and South - we have a wee 'delivery network') but am currently waiting for the UK wholesaler to get back to me with apisuc prices. The annoying thing is that some people will not even give a tentative estimate of what they might buy until I get a price and the wholesaler won't give a price until i have a firm indication of the quantity I want to purchase and so it goes on.... I'll get it sorted one of these days!


Yes Teemore, I covered that here

"I believe this forum is principally for the smaller beekeeper who is happy to club together with his fellow man or woman and buy products in bulk when warranted. "

I do wholeheartedly agree that people won't say what they are going to have until the last minute. An instance was when our association asked all members around the table to say how much they wanted. Only two answered and it looked like no order was going to be arriving. We put our hands up and said we would buy almost 2/3rds of the order.

On arrival, the association told us we couldn't even have as much as we had originally wanted as it would be 'unfair' not to share it out with other members!!!! We were then told it would be better for us to order it separately.

Well that's nice isn't it. :rolleyes:

Sadly, it makes for a dog eat dog environment where it's easy to catch cold.

So, best of luck, it's thankless and stay on your toes or you might be eating syrup for a long time to come. :)
 
BBG:- I will introduce you to the selling agent for the UK, at least for Apisuc. You can negotiate your own price and get it delivered diect from the factory with no middle men involved.

Ambrosia is in something of a pyramid selling situation, and by the time it trickles down to the small guy its price bears no resemblance to the ex works plus freight rate.

There are at least 2 big bites in play, and before the final dealers margin is added you are already somethig like 30% above ex works pricing.

Whoever quoted you a price higher than Ambrosia for Apisuc bears close scrutiny. It leaves the factory at about £150 a tonne LESS, and does not have to pass through the danish selling agents hands first with their margin added, their one of their UK agents, then finall maybe a beekeeper/stockist as well. Those who bought bulk Apisuc were simply introduced by me direct to their UK agency (almost a direct employee working on a vanishingly small commission of 3% or less), so if their prices are higher than Ambrosia something is afoot.

PM me for direct introduction. They will send over anything in multiples of pallet loads, or tanker bulk...........they have Apisuc, InvertBee, both invert liquid feeds and supplied in various pack sizes up to IBC, Fondabee in big blocks or pre portioned packs, and a few other products too.

Associations or individuals grouping together should be able to get this stuff economically. Have beekeepers in here today collecting Apisuc from me. Their own buckets, 70p a kilo.
 
In addition, one of the most repeated rules here is 'no advertising', which long predates the arrival of myself on the forum. I do not want to be seen to infringe upon the convention here.
 
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If I see sugar sale price 0.9 or 0.8 , how far I can drive with car when advantage is gone.
Gasoline price is such that driving here and there costs more than winter food.

Winter food is a big business when we think annual costs of bee yard. To feed couple of hives is not much, 50 pounds? With that price a drive car 500 km. The difference with 2 prices is 5 pound.
 
What's the equivalent in dry weight of sugar of a kilo of Apisuc ?
 

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