Hunting wasps

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Karol

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Hi,

I've had several bee keepers approach me this week for advice as they've had wasps attacking their hives and the use of traps doesn't seem to be working. I hope you don't mind but I thought it might be helpful to share some of that advice.

Basically wasps will come to bee hives for three reasons: to pulp wood for nest building, to hunting for protein to feed their brood and finally to scavenge honey.

The first and third reasons are relatively easily dealt with and are for another time. The second reason, i.e. hunting for protein is more of an issue.

Hunting wasps will ignore sweet foods including sweet baited traps. They are driven to hunt for protein to feed their brood. As wasp nests mature the number of grubs in the nest increases almost exponentially especially with the production of the sexual progeny and the brood need animal (insect) protein to develop. Normally this wouldn't be an issue in normal years where wasp numbers are low and there's an abundance of other insects. However, in heavy wasp years, there's terrific competition between wasp nests and insect prey becomes relatively scarce. When this happens wasps are forced to find high density sources of protein which essentially means bee hives or other wasp colonies. In a 'normal' year wasps would not entertain attacking bee hives for protein as this is high risk for them. They might visit hives to pick off old and dying honey bees which is fine because it helps keep the hives free from potentially diseased honey bees. The problem comes if they intensify their hunting and attack the hive proper for protein.

In situations like this a couple of hours could see a hive wiped out with wasps taking not only adult worker bees but also the brood - it's heart breaking and devastating to see. So it's important to monitor wasp hunting behaviour. For as long as the wasps are taking odd solitary honey bees outside of the hive then that shouldn't be anything to worry about. If they start attacking the hive proper then quick remedial action will need to be taken and there are strategies that can be used. If this happens to you pm me and I will provide advice. Otherwise in the mean time ensure that you have entrances that are easily defendable - i.e. under-floor entrances or tunnel entrances that afford multiple ranks of defending honey bees and do not under any circumstances squash wasps on the hive as this will only serve to intensify the attack through the production of powerful alarm pheromones. It's also worth removing any wasps that have died or are dying in the vicinity of the hive to reduce attraction from this source.
 
:iagree:
Maybe this thread is intended for beginners? Strange advice.
I have never had any problems with wasp raids in spring or summer. Autumn is the time I have problems.
The OP concentrates on the protein-seeking activity and does not emphasise the point that later in the season wasps needs and tastes change, and they visit a hive to seek sweet things, often going for uncapped part-evaporated nectar for a quick in-out raid, or ripping into stored honey. This is just starting to happen now here in the west country, and I would guess is the real reason several bee keepers have apparently approached the OP this week. Why all this protein stuff?
I don't agree about the alarm pheromones. In about 15 mins this afternoon I squished 4 or 5 yellow sods into the landing board while they were trying to sneak past guards. No mob turned up. I'm sure that the pheremone attack reaction would only apply close to the actual wasp nest, as it does with bees.

Bees that get in the way of these raiding wasps are outgunned by superior strength stronger jaws etc. Also, wasps are more active in lower temperatures and so are up earlier and back home later. One wasp can see off a number of bees.
I admire them and hate them too.
Anyhow, I look forward to hearing how this problem is "relatively easily dealt with". Until then I'll be 'hunting wasps' my way.
 
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Don't recall mentioning anything about spring or summer. I've posted extensively on managing wasps during their sweet feeding phase and you are welcome to review those posts. There is a point just prior to wasps sweet feeding when there is a crescendo in their hunting behaviour where depending on all sorts of variables hives are placed at greatest risk. Being able to recognise when this happens will be the difference between losing and saving a hive. Best analogy I can think of is a tsunami. Doesn't happen very often but when it does it's usually too late to respond. Having an early tsunami warning system is invaluable.

I'm delighted that you've never had a 'tsunami' and I hope you never do. I have witnessed a hive torn apart by hunting wasps and everything goes - brood and adults alike with nothing left save pared off limbs. I also get to meet and help bee keepers from all over the country and am regularly called upon for help by bee keepers having problems with nuisance wasps. Thankfully as I've said, tsunamis are rare, as are to a slightly lesser extent beekeeper induced pheromone driven frenzied feeding attacks.
 
Our wasp happening is over now. They have no food and they have met their natural end.

2 weeks ago I killed thousands of wasps per day. They went into traps.

In my cottage I killed tens every day with vacuum cleaner.
 
.....Thankfully as I've said, tsunamis are rare, as are to a slightly lesser extent beekeeper induced pheromone driven frenzied feeding attacks.
Agreed, so I don't really understand the purpose of your dramatic post.
 
Interesting how many who indiscriminately kill wasps appear to be plagued by them whereas others who act more selectively are not.....
 
Thank you for an informative and helpful post. This is exactly what I am observing in our garden. Our neighbour has a large wasps next in their roofspace which they haven't tackled and our garden is full of wasps.

Interestingly they are ignoring the new smaller hive and going for the double brood hive. Both are down to a single beespace entrance. But the wasps are certainly picking off any weak bees they can get at.

The small hive has a landing board and when the wasps are about the bees come out and group around the entrance - the wasps then leave them alone.

The large hive has no landing board and the wasps seem to dart in and try to pick off the odd bee from the entrance hole. The bees are clearly fighting back because there are some dead wasps on the ground.

I am thinking of trying something a chap in our association told me at the weekend. He gets a bit of thin flexible plastic and pins it over the entrance so it forms a tunnel at right angles to the entrance (similar the use of a piece of clear guttering as described in a recent journal). Put on at night and in the morning the bees figure out how to navigate it, the wasps can't work it out and just bounce off it.

My cousin had 5 hives wiped out by wasps a couple of years ago so I'm keeping a close eye. I'll take any advice I can get to stop them.
 
As this is my first yr beekeeping I'm very concerned about wasps. There's always one or two hanging about but not had any real problems so far. I have a couple of traps away from the bees but only catch the odd one. Am I worrying unduly?
 
Thanks for the post. Appreciate it.
 
:iagree:
Maybe this thread is intended for beginners? Strange advice.
I have never had any problems with wasp raids in spring or summer. Autumn is the time I have problems.
The OP concentrates on the protein-seeking activity and does not emphasise the point that later in the season wasps needs and tastes change, and they visit a hive to seek sweet things, often going for uncapped part-evaporated nectar for a quick in-out raid, or ripping into stored honey. This is just starting to happen now here in the west country, and I would guess is the real reason several bee keepers have apparently approached the OP this week. Why all this protein stuff?
I don't agree about the alarm pheromones. In about 15 mins this afternoon I squished 4 or 5 yellow sods into the landing board while they were trying to sneak past guards. No mob turned up. I'm sure that the pheremone attack reaction would only apply close to the actual wasp nest, as it does with bees.

Bees that get in the way of these raiding wasps are outgunned by superior strength stronger jaws etc. Also, wasps are more active in lower temperatures and so are up earlier and back home later. One wasp can see off a number of bees.
I admire them and hate them too.
Anyhow, I look forward to hearing how this problem is "relatively easily dealt with". Until then I'll be 'hunting wasps' my way.

Maybe this does belong in the beginners' section.

I am still seeing dismembered bees on top of one of my hives (three this morning). At least round here, it seems to be more to do with protein than sweetness.
 
Agreed, so I don't really understand the purpose of your dramatic post.

Not really with it at all are you? and I saw nothing dramatic at all in the post.
Karol's posts are always informative and helpful and I think most forum members appreciate his learned advice.
You carry on foolishly squishing wasps all over your hives - I'd prefer to follow the advice of someone who has a wealth of knowledge about wasp behaviour as he has studied the subject for years.

Personally, I don't see the purpose of your rather derisive post.
 
Not really with it at all are you? and I saw nothing dramatic at all in the post.
Karol's posts are always informative and helpful and I think most forum members appreciate his learned advice.
You carry on foolishly squishing wasps all over your hives - I'd prefer to follow the advice of someone who has a wealth of knowledge about wasp behaviour as he has studied the subject for years.

Personally, I don't see the purpose of your rather derisive post.

Well, that's me told then! :blush

My opinion is that the thread would have been more useful if it had gone along the lines of:
Wasps may attack bees, and if so, these are possible remedies from my wealth of knowledge.
As is, it merely alarms folks like 'webby' above.
 
Well, that's me told then! :blush

My opinion is that the thread would have been more useful if it had gone along the lines of:
Wasps may attack bees, and if so, these are possible remedies from my wealth of knowledge.
As is, it merely alarms folks like 'webby' above.
It's ok I was already alarmed. : )
 
Well, that's me told then! :blush

My opinion is that the thread would have been more useful if it had gone along the lines of:
Wasps may attack bees, and if so, these are possible remedies from my wealth of knowledge.
As is, it merely alarms folks like 'webby' above.
It's ok I was already alarmed: )
 
Well, that's me told then! :blush

My opinion is that the thread would have been more useful if it had gone along the lines of:
Wasps may attack bees, and if so, these are possible remedies from my wealth of knowledge.
As is, it merely alarms folks like 'webby' above.

OK I acknowledge that you're not happy with the post.

The post specifically deals with one aspect of wasp attacks on hives. That's what I've been asked advice on not just by novice beekeepers. I've not been asked about sweet feeding or anything else at this time - just hunting behaviour. The message is simple. Rest easy if you have wasps taking solitary honeybees. Monitor for escalation and consider three preventative measures.

If you would like to receive different information then just ask the question.
 
Well, that's me told then! :blush

My opinion is that the thread would have been more useful if it had gone along the lines of:
Wasps may attack bees, and if so, these are possible remedies from my wealth of knowledge.
As is, it merely alarms folks like 'webby' above.

I do not think anyone should be alarmed, as long as there is a reasonable amount of bees in the hive and the entrance is modified to be easily defended, the wasps will have there work cut out and little if any will gain access.
I did a little experiment last week with several frames of uncapped honey and dead drone brood from a shaken out drone laying worker colony, i opened up the sealed brood box to see what would happen and i was quite surprised.
I have seen no wasp activity this year, around my strong colony with a modified tunnel entrance.
However the bee less hive with frames of nectar and wide open entrance attracted several wasps after 10 minuets, after 1 hour they was around 50 , roughly another hour later they was hundreds of wasps inside and around the hive.
If that was a weak colony with that wide open entrance i think the bees would have stood little chance with the speed in which the wasps gathered.
The frames have now been burnt and the brood box removed for storage.
The moral of the story from what i have seen, is do not leave wide open entrances and you should have nothing too worry about.
 
What would be the best bite to go into the wasp trap at this time of the year?

I have had a wasp bane trap hung on a fence for about 2wks and there is a good amount of wasps in it already, the bait i used is some Fosters larger a bit of strawberry jam and some brewers yeast.
 
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