Honey in Demaree

[Firefly]

My 2 week old Demaree has succeeded so far (despite missing 3 QC in the top box on the 1st check - oops). Brood thinning out in the top box; drawing comb and laying in the bottom box; bees happy

However, as Wally Shaw warns, as fast as they are hatching brood, they are filling the cells with honey - never mind that the 2 supers are far from full

He says extract it. Do I have any other options?

After another week, if I just swap the boxes (and put the queen in the bottom, of course), will they move the honey to the supers, or will they just think they have run out of laying room and swarm?

What about moving it below the QE to make conventional double brood, and giving them another super - will they empty it then, or just seal it?

Any other thoughts?

Thanks

 

[Finman]

.
You must have wider view what are you doing with your hive, not just demareering

If you want honey, first you should maximize the brood production. Then enlargening hive according colony size. Bees tend to store honey up. No idea to put honey again down that bees move it back and worth. Every movement costs energy, and less honey.

When you have honey in the upper box, add next box just over the brood box.

 

[jenkinsbrynmair]

My 2 week old Demaree has succeeded so far (despite missing 3 QC in the top box on the 1st check - oops). Brood thinning out in the top box; drawing comb and laying in the bottom box; bees happy

However, as Wally Shaw warns, as fast as they are hatching brood, they are filling the cells with honey - never mind that the 2 supers are far from full

He says extract it. Do I have any other options?

After another week, if I just swap the boxes (and put the queen in the bottom, of course), will they move the honey to the supers, or will they just think they have run out of laying room and swarm?

What about moving it below the QE to make conventional double brood, and giving them another super - will they empty it then, or just seal it?

Any other thoughts?

Thanks

What options do you want? you can either let them backfill and extract as with any other super frame or (if you decide to conduct a demarree properly) take empty/emerged frames from the top box as they become available and put them in the bottom box, filling the gap in the top box with frames of brood from the bottom - thus ensuring the queen always has plenty of space to lay and supressing any swarming urges - remember the correct method of Demarree would have drawn comb in the bottom box not foundation and would take far more than two weeks to complete.

 

[Firefly]

What options do you want? you can either let them backfill and extract as with any other super frame or (if you decide to conduct a demarree properly) take empty/emerged frames from the top box as they become available and put them in the bottom box, filling the gap in the top box with frames of brood from the bottom - thus ensuring the queen always has plenty of space to lay and supressing any swarming urges - remember the correct method of Demarree would have drawn comb in the bottom box not foundation and would take far more than two weeks to complete.

Thanks JBM

But for example, what I have is a frame (or in fact 8 or 9 similar frames) in the top box where the older brood in the centre have emerged, but the younger brood on the extremity are still incubating. Nevertheless the colony have 50-70% filled the emerged cells with nectar

Yes, it's precisely because I want to keep the Demaree going and keep circulating the frames between boxes that I'm concerned. By the time the brood in the top box has all emerged, I'm going to be circulating frames of honey from top to bottom. I'm not sure what the reaction of the colony will be to that

Using foundation rather than drawn comb was a Hobson's choice, but that bit has actually gone rather well: comb well drawn and queen laying well

 

[beeno]

Hi Firefly,
Bottom brood box, QE, super and top brood box with all the brood plus top entrance too for drones. Watch out for QC in top box though. Alternatively, you could run as double brood, QE and super/s and swap brood boxes as queen tends to move up.

 

[idg]

or (if you decide to conduct a demarree properly) take empty/emerged frames from the top box as they become available and put them in the bottom box, filling the gap in the top box with frames of brood from the bottom - thus ensuring the queen always has plenty of space to lay and supressing any swarming urges.

When you say move frames of brood to top box, should this be of a certain age to stop QC formation or is that inevitable?

 

[Tom Bick]

Give the bees a super over the top bb. Or go with your other option and put them on double brood with the brood in the top bb.

 

[TryingToLetThemBee]

A pont often made on here which may be reassuring is that in a standard BB/super hive nectar is initially stored in the BB.

 

[Firefly]

Give the bees a super over the top bb. Or go with your other option and put them on double brood with the brood in the top bb.

Thanks Tom. Interesting that you would put the brood on top. I thought if I put brood on the bottom it would encourage them to empty out the honey and move up. Wrong again?

 

[Firefly]

When you say move frames of brood to top box, should this be of a certain age to stop QC formation or is that inevitable?

That's hard to do. It's pretty unavoidable to put some eggs in the top and there is a likelihood they will create emergency QC. You have to keep looking, or put in a board and treat it as an AS

I do know a very experienced beekeeper who simply put a QE and a couple of sticks under the back of the top BB to make an entrance and let them get on with it. No faffing about with Snellgrove/Horsely boards etc. That's a bit left-field for me though - and he does have hundreds of hives, so the risks are different!

 

[Tom Bick]

Thanks Tom. Interesting that you would put the brood on top. I thought if I put brood on the bottom it would encourage them to empty out the honey and move up. Wrong again?

I have found that if the bees start to use the top bb for honey it can be difficult to get them to stop and you can end up with a bb full of honey. This can be a particular problem if the queen is not quite up to filling a double brood. By having the empty brood on the bottom the bees move down when they need the extra room so this may only be half of the bottom brood. This perhaps works best if the bottom bb is empty undrawn frames if they are drawn then the bees can easily move down and you get more honey in the top bb. I would say there is more chance to get the bees to move honey up into supers if it's placed under the brood nest as they prefer to store honey over the brood.

 

[jenkinsbrynmair]

Move any age brood to the top box. An important part of the demarree system is opening up regularly and taking down queen cells until they give up making them you then know swarming fever is over