Grumpy Bees and Requeening to improve temper

[Ringlander]

My medium sized colony of quite aggressive Norfolk Mongrels have requeened after their old queen stopped laying and I removed her and introduced a frame with a queen cell on from a colony with a much nicer disposition. She has hatched and mated with whoever she could find and is now laying with great enthusiasm. Should I expect to see an improvement in the bees attitude fairly soon or do I have to wait until the new brood comes on stream? Currently they seem no less aggressive than before, but she's only been laying for around 9 days.
Thanks!

 

[coffindodger]

You've got to wait at least (21-9) days for the new bees to hatch. Then wait for the 'old' bees to die - another 3 weeks - before you can be sure.

 

[enrico]

It is do difficult to say. Sometimes they change rapidly, sometimes as coffindodger says, and sometimes it doesn't work at all. Fingers crossed!
E

 

[Ringlander]

OK, thanks guys, I'll keep my fingers crossed.

 

[Amari]

It is do difficult to say. Sometimes they change rapidly, sometimes as coffindodger says, and sometimes it doesn't work at all. Fingers crossed!
E

The eternal conundrum, what governs bees' temperament: nature (the genes the bees inherited) or nurture (the queen's pheromones)? I can never predict.

 

[Finman]

Only way is to change the queen. It does not need much philosophy.

 

[enrico]

Only way is to change the queen. It does not need much philosophy.

Then why did you out this in a similar post Finman?
(Then you will have one nasty hive.. . Nasty bees in the hive will protect themselves as before.)
I am confused with what you believe!
E

 

[Ringlander]

Success!

Just by way of completing the story the temper of the bees improved considerably just as soon as the new queen started laying and they have calmed down even more now that most of the old queens brood has expired. Complete pussycats now.... So exactly as you said guys, thanks!

 

[enrico]

Thanks so much for the update, always welcome
E

 

[Swarm]

You dealt with the problem very efficiently, IMO.

 

[Erichalfbee]

Then why did you out this in a similar post Finman?
(Then you will have one nasty hive.. . Nasty bees in the hive will protect themselves as before.)
I am confused with what you believe!
E

I think what Finnie means is that if you let an aggressive hive make their own new queen they stand a pretty good chance of being just as bad and the only realistic solution is to re queen with a gentle queen.

 

[jenkinsbrynmair]

I think what Finnie means is that if you let an aggressive hive make their own new queen they stand a pretty good chance of being just as bad and the only realistic solution is to re queen with a gentle queen.

 

[enrico]

Thanks both!

 

[Finman]

It is do difficult to say. Sometimes they change rapidly, sometimes as coffindodger says, and sometimes it doesn't work at all. Fingers crossed!
E

I do not understand your advice Enrico: cross your fingers?

How it helps?

 

[enrico]

I do not understand your advice Enrico: cross your fingers?

How it helps?

I was just trying to say that adding a queen from another colony is a risk when you don't know who she has mated with. You may get a good queen or you may not. Until she has emerged, mated and laying you will not know her temperament. So you have to keep your fingers crossed until you find out.
Keeping your fingers crossed means we hope it works for you!
E

 

[Finman]

.
Propability to get an angry queen from angry hive is very big. Hope does not help.

But surely drones have big meaning too. A queen mates with over 10 drones and then it is enough that only part of drones have hot blood.

 

[jenkinsbrynmair]

.
Propability to get an angry queen from angry hive is very big. Hope does not help.

You're correct, but in this case the OP has given them a queencell from a docile hive. Not let them make their own queen.

 

[oxnatbees]

Your problem is that F2 crosses can be grumpy.

This works both ways. By continually introducing queens of another race, you are making all colonies in the area grumpy.

My suggestion is to leave them to supersede and blend towards the local landrace's genetics. Locals are gentle if handled gently, and not crossed with introduced races.

Obviously queen breeders will argue that the problem is the local race, that there are no local bees etc - we've heard all that before. Pause and think how they make money.

Using local survivor bees will mean you don't need to treat with miticides (which improves their temper). Honey production is mainly about size of colony and weather; you can't control the latter but you can control swarming to some extent by careful management, making room when needed etc.

 

[Swarm]

Your problem is that F2 crosses can be grumpy.

This works both ways. By continually introducing queens of another race, you are making all colonies in the area grumpy.

My suggestion is to leave them to supersede and blend towards the local landrace's genetics. Locals are gentle if handled gently, and not crossed with introduced races.

Obviously queen breeders will argue that the problem is the local race, that there are no local bees etc - we've heard all that before. Pause and think how they make money.

Using local survivor bees will mean you don't need to treat with miticides (which improves their temper). Honey production is mainly about size of colony and weather; you can't control the latter but you can control swarming to some extent by careful management, making room when needed etc.

 

[Hebeegeebee]

Sometimes a new queen will improve their temper within a few days, othertimes it takes a couple of months in summer from removal of the unwanted queen before they behave themselves - 3 weeks as egg, 3 weeks as house bees, 3 weeks as flyers, before they die off.

I have seen colonies improve within hours of a queen being removed and before a new one goes in. Therefore there must be something that the queen is doing that makes them so.
I have seen it where a queen is being superceded over a few weeks but she keeps killing the queen in the queencell, so the bees can't get to the stage where they replace her. Once she has gone, they are happy bunnies.