Grafting gone wrong. Any tips for next time please?

[jeff33]

I grafted last week and yesterday was time to transfer the cells to mini mating nucs. I used a demaree method with added brood to raise the cells and used a board for 48h to separate the top box. All worked well, by day 8 I had lots of lovely capped cells but when I went in yesterday they had drawn comb in the frame entirely covering the q cells. I only managed to cut out 2 and remove enough wax to put them in a protective cage.

Is it normal for this to happen? Should you usually remove all cells once capped?

 

[B+.]

Is it normal for this to happen? Should you usually remove all cells once capped?

If you put a sheet of foundation a couple of frames away from the graft, they'll draw comb there instead.
When you raise queens, you are actually creating a situation where they are overcrowded, queenless, with no brood to feed except your grafts and they are so well fed that their wax glands secrete wax. It has to go somewhere - so, give them something to do with it. A sheet of foundation is ideal.

 

[Ian123]

Yes its common you can normaly cut any wax away if your carefull, i like the idea of a frame of foundation if it becomes an issue

 

[jeff33]

Thanks both, I also like the idea of a frame of foundation. I have also added a scalpel to my toolbox for such occasion so I can cut away the wax.

 

[Hivemaker.]

Is it normal for this to happen? Should you usually remove all cells once capped?

You can remove them shortly after capping if need be, the wax webbing around cells during a light flow can be avoided to a point by adding some foundation, but during a heavy flow a strong cell builder will draw and fill it in a couple of hours... and then continue to fill in around the cells, best way I found to avoid that is to add a super, and they will often fill that during the short time the cells are in the hive.

 

[eltalia]

"Is it normal for this to happen? "

Are you feeding?

Bill

 

[SDM]

Are you using hoffman spacing on your cell bar ? Using DN1 side bars will cut down on comb building. No need to respect normal bee space with a cell bar.

 

[jeff33]

Yes the bar is a DN4 SDM maybe I can adapt a DN1 to test.
HM, there was actually another flow starting last week and they were filling frames quickly. I will keep an eye on flows next time around.

Bill, I wasn't feeding, they had enough nectar in the BB.

 

[Poly Hive]

I use manley side bars.

PH

 

[eltalia]

(edit)
I wasn't feeding, they had enough nectar in the BB.

Thanks mate... the question pops as many do impetus feed
believing supplement is required, it isn't... comb build is just
one reactive.
As you'll figure yourself from guidance being offered they
have built comb so in _their_ perception of insufficent room
for whatever, regardless of what you see (do) in free space.
There are a number of options in config to avoid such in future.

Bill

 

[SDM]

Thanks mate... the question pops as many do impetus feed
believing supplement is required, it isn't.


Bill

My hives have been confined by weather 3 out of the last 5 days. Still think feeding isn't necessary?

 

[For want of a better word]

Thanks mate... the question pops as many do impetus feed
believing supplement is required, it isn't...

Bill

Lots of variables and do's and dont's rarely apply to beekeeping IMOHO!
OK in hot sunny Ozzieland..... been cool here past few days..... tossed in a couple of kilo of Candipol into queenright finishers... just to be double sure the little ******* have enough to feed on!
Use undrawn foundation in the finisher box on outside frames... usually gets drawn out!

Yeghes da

 

[eltalia]

Lots of variables...

Indeed, inclusive of some choosing to raise queens in
conditions varying from foolhardy to seriously a dumb
thing to do.
Not a breeder - we buy in - however it does happen a
queen or two pops in emergencies, yet where conditions
aren't suitable for a reasonable chance of success other
options are pursued....feeding is not one of those.

Bill

 

[eltalia]

My hives have been confined by weather 3 out of the
last 5 days. Still think feeding isn't necessary?

Try managing through now 5months of dearth.
Between bushfires and flooding rains - now coming into
'winter' drizzle - flying days between Nov2018 and June 2019
wouldn't number as many as there are Bingo balls.

/wrinkles nose/

Bill

 

[SDM]

Indeed, inclusive of some choosing to raise queens in
conditions varying from foolhardy to seriously a dumb
thing to do.
Not a breeder - we buy in - however it does happen a
queen or two pops in emergencies, yet where conditions
aren't suitable for a reasonable chance of success other
options are pursued....feeding is not one of those.

Bill

What other options , and what system of fortune telling do you recommend to predict the chances of success in a UK summer ?

 

[For want of a better word]

What other options , and what system of fortune telling do you recommend to predict the chances of success in a UK summer ?

Did you ever wonder why gypsie fortunetellers have glass balls?

Chons da

 

[eltalia]

What other options...

These belong in the "General" section of the forum hence my
ommission in the post, this being the breeders forum.
However enough to offer options are limited to one's skillset as
a beekeeper and so yes I understand why it is newbies choose to
"have a go"... part and parcel of any learning curve.

Bill

 

[SDM]

Au contraire.
Do tell us how to raise well nourished queens in periods of bad weather without feeding it'll surely become a sticky at least, maybe a new master class section is needed .

 

[SDM]

Did you ever wonder why gypsie fortunetellers have glass balls?

Chons da

Not until just now.

 

[eltalia]

Au contraire.
Do tell us how to raise well nourished queens in periods of bad weather without feeding it'll surely
become a sticky at least, maybe a new master class section is needed .

See my original comment (post #13).

Quality breeders will tell you it is only colonys packed with bees - to the rafters -
and ample stores for the duration that are used as raisers and finishers.
Choose to do something else the onus is yours only. It is not so uncommon
today to have the experience of poor queens supplied, more's the pity.

Bill