First winter

[Uncle Betty]

I have no prejudice except against stupidity.

I don't think an insert was mentioned?

PH

Why don't you just come out with it and say why clear crown boards are a stupid idea ?

 

[Millet]

Why don't you just come out with it and say why clear crown boards are a stupid idea ?

When i first seen them i thought moisture retention could be a problem, thin wooden crown boards can breath a little plastic of any kind is totally water proof, that is my take on the matter and i personally do not like them either.

 

[Uncle Betty]

When i first seen them i thought moisture retention could be a problem, thin wooden crown boards can breath a little plastic of any kind is totally water proof, that is my take on the matter and i personally do not like them either.

Fine, no problem.

However, saying that 'bees hate overhead condensation' is not the same as saying 'bees love warmth, so throw your clear crown boards in the bin'.

Inserts or no.

Better in the Beginners' section to make things straightforward.

 

[Curly green fingers]

Fine, no problem.

However, saying that 'bees hate overhead condensation' is not the same as saying 'bees love warmth, so throw your clear crown boards in the bin'.

Inserts or no.

Better in the Beginners' section to make things straightforward.

Hey there's a bit of Christmas spirit on here isn't there

 

[Newbeebeekeeper]

Well i for one am still very excited about having bees and i love looking inside without the fear of it all going horribly wrong in the stinging department. A local bee keeper showed me her hive and i loved the idea she has had it for over 30 years. I put in the perspex and got a really good guy to put wood around it to give me bee space. Then went nuts with the best insulation that i could find.
If you have strong opinions on things please back them up with facts if you have them and justify them. It would be much more helpful than giving the impression that we are stupid as our actions differ from yours.
Settle down keyboard warriors lol

 

[Poly Hive]

Taking as a given that bees like warmth.

These perspex inners are thin and cold and people use them with no insulation and then talk about condensation on them. Ho hum... no surprise there is there as warm air holds moisture and said moisture condenses on a cold surface. Hence the wet water tank in a badly ventilated en-suite.

I have been using poly for near 30 years now and have never seen signs of condensation. I do though use plywood CBs.

PH

 

[Erichalfbee]

After all the proselytising from the Insulation police here I bet there isn’t a single beekeeper on here with an uninsulated clear crownboard. I think they are fab and my thermal image camera agrees with me.

 

[Hivemaker.]

These perspex inners are thin and cold and people use them with no insulation and then talk about condensation on them

 

[Uncle Betty]

Taking as a given that bees like warmth.

These perspex inners are thin and cold and people use them with no insulation and then talk about condensation on them. Ho hum... no surprise there is there as warm air holds moisture and said moisture condenses on a cold surface. Hence the wet water tank in a badly ventilated en-suite.
PH

A neat argument for 50mm of PIR, not for throwing clear crown boards into the skip.

With great respect, you're here long enough to know the score re insulated roofs.

 

[jenkinsbrynmair]

These see through CBs are a bloody stupid idea and belong in the nearest skip.

Bees love warmth. Think about it.

PH

Most beekeepers I know Put a roof on above their crownboards. That helps with insulation, notwithstanding the almost sheet of PIR used nowadays - think about it.

What a crass statement - obviously on the second six fingers of the Boxing day turps.

 

[Gwr]

These see through CBs are a bloody stupid idea and belong in the nearest skip.

Bees love warmth. Think about it.

PH

That’s not the kind of quick, incomplete and put down comment I’d expect or want to see in the beginners section if I’m honest, especially the off the cuff ‘Think about it’ comment.

You obviously knew it was a beginner asking the question and the hive is clearly a poly one and thus has insulation above the crownboard, so do give your opinion but please quantify the reason so everyone can learn and judge for them self what they want to do about it.

Lets help beginners and not make them embarrassed to ask their questions by offering silly unclear comments and then become defensive when someone picks you up on it, because I think I can honestly say that we all were all a beginner once.

On the clear crown board question, The local bee company to us runs over 300 hives with clear plastic sheet crown boards on thier wooden national hives for the last 35 years they have told me ( they owned a plastic fabrication company for many years so I guess that’s why ) but it does run winter insulation in thier very deep roofs I guess to stop condensation and the heat loss.

Me, I run wooden crow boards and 100mm insulation ( free from my local builders merchants as they are the spacers used to allow forklifts to unload the pre packed sheets ) in most of my hives but I also suffer significant damp on the crown boards but perhaps that has more to do with my location than what my crown board is made off, as we have well over 1400mm of rain every year here so we are in a damp location I guess you’d say.

 

[Poly Hive]

No put down was or is intended.

Now Gwr? Would you like to present your credentials for your rather rude post?

I like my students to think. Hence my comment.

Your friends with their lots of colonies with their plastic lids may actually be kept in a better way? Has that occurred to you?

PH

 

[Hivemaker.]

Your friends with their lots of colonies with their plastic lids may actually be kept in a better way? Has that occurred to you?

 

[Poly Hive]

Good grief Pete, are we setting a record here?

Just for the record (in the other sense) I have taught getting on for 300 people and am currently mentoring 9.

I do not believe in spoon feeding. I prefer to challenge and provoke thinking and my classes like it.
PH

 

[Hivemaker.]

Good grief Pete, are we setting a record here?
I do not believe in spoon feeding.

No not really, Pete, you know me better than that, I just happen to agree with you, so not much more to say really than, I agree.

As for spoon feeding, I agree on that also, far too many that appear to need spoon feeding as they appear incapable of thinking for themselves, we had much the same on the II forum which was run by Dave Cushman, and Dave soon told them what he thought about that in no uncertain terms.

 

[Gwr]

Good grief Pete, are we setting a record here?

Just for the record (in the other sense) I have taught getting on for 300 people and am currently mentoring 9.

I do not believe in spoon feeding. I prefer to challenge and provoke thinking and my classes like it.
PH

Provoking thinking is great and works wonders when your in front of a group showing something or illustrating what your doing in real time but on a forum when there’s new visual prompts to help clarify the short point it’s not so good.

Credentials, well on this beginners point and my ‘what to say’ comment, I run my own sales, design and training company employing 12 full time staff and 3 part time. We right our own training material teaching endusers, sales people, engineers and distributors. I teach from beginners up to OEM manufacturing level to small private business and up to blue chip companies and they all pay for it. I personally teach approximately 25 to 30 people a week, 8 months of the year and have done since 1991 ( slightly more than 300 people ) We’ve never advertised for work or sales and all this training business comes to us.

I am oxford university trained as a technical writer and I also sit on several government recognised technical committees writing end user product documentation and manuals, industry codes of practice, British standards and UK & European regulations - we do not get paid for any of this tech committee work but it all helps recognise what it a help and an inderance to someone who’s new, learning and progressing in thier market sector needs.

Bees wise, I’ve been keeping them for 25 years, lost a few along the way but really enjoy it. I am currently mentoring 15 newbies in the local area ( 50 mile radius from my home ) and for the last 12 years I have worked with the local council as a mentor and training support to thier own pest controllers on honeybees. ( all free of charge as my training day job funds this mentor work )

Hope that clarifies my credentials as it’s the first time I’ve put it all in writing.

 

[Madge]

Your friends with their lots of colonies with their plastic lids may actually be kept in a better way? Has that occurred to you?



PH

Once again: clear crown boards are fine as long as there is insulation above it - there won’t be any condensation dripping from the crown board onto the bees. So, what is better than that?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[Gilberdyke John]

I have no prejudice except against stupidity.

I don't think an insert was mentioned?

PH

Is it really necessary to explain (yet again) how condensation forms on cold surfaces and by cutting a piece of insulation such as kingspan to fit inside the edge of the frame, tight to the perspex the perspex is kept warm and thus does not present the conditions for water vapour to condense?
No doubt you sincerely believe what you said but a lot of beekeepers (myself included) have moved on and joined the 21st century.

 

[Poly Hive]

Gilbert? There is a NDB person still extolling the virtues of matchsticks... need I say more?

PH

 

[SteveG]

my first year and had similar question.

Found this link. https://honeybeesuite.com/dead-bees-in-winter/