First inspection

[RobKing]

I have two colonies that were introduced last year, in June. They have doing well over the mild winter, and when I looked at both of them yesterday afternoon, I was stunned at how they had expanded. The smaller of the two colonies still has a couple of frames to use in the brood, but I supered up anyway. The other hive was almost boiling with bees in the brood - so difficult to take it all in - I tried to find the queen, twice, but to no avail. Loads of bees bringing in rape pollen, so assume that the queen is there, somewhere. I did notice that this colony was quite aggressive towards me - I got stung several times yesterday through my protective suit. I wonder whether something has happened in this hive and that the queen may have been replaced, but I have not seen any evidence of queen cells at all. Why else may they have been angry? I am always gentle, and take my time. I noticed that when I had to use my smoker, they did not like it (old egg boxes, I use, and cool smoke). I do worry, but I hope that I haven't lost my queen from last year. I would like to expand this colony into 2 by artificial swarm sometime this year. Also, can I replace a full food frame in the brood for an empty one, if they clearly do not need the food, but need space?

 

[enrico]

A couple of things, they will be building fast on rape and rape does have the tendency to bring out their tempers! Put a second layer of clothes under your jacket before the stings make you lose confidence. Stop looking for the queen. I have many years of experience and can still miss them. Get used to looking for eggs, if there are eggs you had a queen in the last three days. Don't worry about her going missing, you are more likely to squash her by looking for her, just look for those eggs! If they are really stuffed for room then one frame will make no difference, give them another box. However don't forget while you have loads of brood now all thus will be emerging and leaving space for her to lay again. It is easy to think she has filled the brood box when all she is doing is replacing emerging brood as she is expected to do! 2000 eggs in a day means that 2000 bees will emerge in a day!!!!
Don't panic, deep breaths, let them get on with it and just make sure they have enough super room if they are in OSR. They can fill a super VERY quickly if they are a strong hive!
Best of luck
E

 

[Cellectronic]

Sound advice Enrico.
The bees seem to be ahead of themselves this year. Hopefully they have had an easy winter for a change and they can get on with what they do best.

 

[stuart]

Winter stores in frames

First full inspection today. Lots of frames with winter stores in
Do I remove and clear out to make room for honey or leave a while longer.
Cells are solid, no OSR around here yet

 

[Nige.Coll]

i've only seen the queen in one of mine once , she is there as i can see larvae and eggs.

don't get obsessed with looking for her all the extra time waving frames round trying to find her will just make them mad .

 

[enrico]

First full inspection today. Lots of frames with winter stores in
Do I remove and clear out to make room for honey or leave a while longer.
Cells are solid, no OSR around here yet

Stuart, you need to start a new thread on this one with a bit more information, do you mean in the bb? Are there any empty cells?
How close is the OSR to you? Are you likely to get any OSR? Do you have any brood at all? Etc. it all helps us to give you a good answer that will help you more hopefully
Cheers
E

 

[Nige.Coll]

Stuart, you need to start a new thread on this one with a bit more information, do you mean in the bb? Are there any empty cells?
How close is the OSR to you? Are you likely to get any OSR? Do you have any brood at all? Etc. it all helps us to give you a good answer that will help you more hopefully
Cheers
E

 

[psafloyd]

Got into (most of) mine this Saturday and had a good poke around. Need to get myself in order to be ready for AS.

 

[YorkshireBees]

...
Loads of bees bringing in rape pollen, so assume that the queen is there, somewhere.

Although pollen entering the hive is always a good sign it in no way guarantees the presence of a queen.
As others have said, don't try and look for the queen and concentrate more on checking for eggs.

...
I did notice that this colony was quite aggressive towards me - I got stung several times yesterday through my protective suit. I wonder whether something has happened in this hive and that the queen may have been replaced, but I have not seen any evidence of queen cells at all. Why else may they have been angry? I am always gentle, and take my time. I noticed that when I had to use my smoker, they did not like it (old egg boxes, I use, and cool smoke). I do worry, but I hope that I haven't lost my queen from last year.

There can be any number of reasons that a colony may be defensive (a better term than aggressive).
Have you washed your beesuit recently? If yes what with?
Were there any rain / thunderstorms within the vicinity?
Did you squash even a single bee during inspection?
etc, etc.
Personally 2 of my colonies were very defensive yesterday when I inspected. Take deep breaths and even step back for a few minutes. I mark mine out of 10 for temper and only after several inspections can you get an idea if the colony is very defensive or it was just not the day / time to inspect.

A couple of things, they will be building fast on rape and rape does have the tendency to bring out their tempers! Put a second layer of clothes under your jacket before the stings make you lose confidence. Stop looking for the queen.

I agree with all of the above sound advice except for the statement in bold
In my experience with OSR bees only tend to change temper when it stops flowering as they go from having an abundance of nectar to have none almost in the space of 24-48hrs!
So in this context I personally would be surprised if OSR had anything to do with the colony's temperament.

 

[RobKing]

A couple of things, they will be building fast on rape and rape does have the tendency to bring out their tempers! Put a second layer of clothes under your jacket before the stings make you lose confidence. Stop looking for the queen. I have many years of experience and can still miss them. Get used to looking for eggs, if there are eggs you had a queen in the last three days. Don't worry about her going missing, you are more likely to squash her by looking for her, just look for those eggs! If they are really stuffed for room then one frame will make no difference, give them another box. However don't forget while you have loads of brood now all thus will be emerging and leaving space for her to lay again. It is easy to think she has filled the brood box when all she is doing is replacing emerging brood as she is expected to do! 2000 eggs in a day means that 2000 bees will emerge in a day!!!!
Don't panic, deep breaths, let them get on with it and just make sure they have enough super room if they are in OSR. They can fill a super VERY quickly if they are a strong hive!
Best of luck
E

Thanks for this very useful reply. My major concern with their defensiveness is that one of the bees yesterday started to pursue my wife who has been very tolerant of my new hobby, up until now. I am just interested as to why the behavior of one of the colonies seems to have changed - I have washed my protective suit in a non-perfumed washing powder to see whether that makes a difference. Possibly two inspections in 2 days didn't help... Interesting that, even the day after, one of the bees went for one of our dogs... I think I will leave them to be and check probably on Thursday before I go away for a bit.

 

[Cellectronic]

Just as a point .
I did an inspection over the weekend and my bees were very well tempered. That was until I breathed on them. I was peering down between the frames then they just kicked off but they soon settled down again.. Another lesson learned.

 

[RobKing]

Highly defensive bees

Not sure what is up with mine but we have to be careful when we venture out of the house.... My first brood inspection was on Saturday and I noticed then that they seemed very restless. Since then a few have been on a vendetta to sting any form of life (me, my wife and the dogs) when we go anywhere their area. The other colony is fine. My fear is that something has happened to the queen and this has changed their demeanor. They are bringing in a lot of OSR, so this may have something too do with it, but it makes it difficult to live near them at the moment. Waiting for it all to die down.

 

[YorkshireBees]

Not sure what is up with mine but we have to be careful when we venture out of the house.... My first brood inspection was on Saturday and I noticed then that they seemed very restless. Since then a few have been on a vendetta to sting any form of life (me, my wife and the dogs) when we go anywhere their area. The other colony is fine. My fear is that something has happened to the queen and this has changed their demeanor. They are bringing in a lot of OSR, so this may have something too do with it, but it makes it difficult to live near them at the moment. Waiting for it all to die down.

As I said before I bet it has nothing to do with OSR as it's only when the OSR stops that sometimes bees turn defensive.

If you disturbed them (inspections) twice in too short a time that will not have helped. I always try and plan most possibilities so that when I inspect I'm ready for most situations and can deal with it in one go.
It doesn't always work and I have noticed that if you have to open up again the same / next day some colonies react to this badly.

I'm afraid that for whatever reason even good tempered bees will have periods throughout the year when they are more defensive and that's one of the main reasons most of my hives are well away from the public in fields.
I have 2 hives in a very large garden at my mothers house and at least once we have had bees that seem intent on chasing / stinging people / animals after an inspection. I try to time inspections now when no one else is near.

Like I said you will have to monitor the situation over the next few inspections to have an idea of the general temperament of the colony.

I have only once re-queened a colony due to behaviour and that because even in a field they were following me after an inspection for too much time / distance! (they also stung me 6-12 times in the ankles but that is a different story!).

Definitely leave them alone for a while and monitor how they are.

It is still very early in the year and dependent on what the weather has been like where you are they may be short on stores?
A colony short on stores can also be quite defensive in my experience.

Regarding stings in the suit, depending on where they sting you (mine tend to go for the cuff of the gloves, a tip is to immediately smoke the area where the sting was to try and mask the alarm pheromone that they give off.

 

[steve56616]

Interesting reading this. I did inspections today with no problems at all, bees were fine and well mannered. However, there seems to be one patrolling the whole garden again. Seems I have this problem every now and then. My garden isn't as big as my previous garden so maybe I'm noticing it more now.
I have no clue what hive this angry bee is from.
Last yr I used to do inspections with no protection but now a bit more weary. Main reason is my reactions to stings has increased and suffer for days from swelling now

 

[RobKing]

Thank you very much for your advice - very, very useful. I will leave to see what happens.

 

[enrico]

Rob, I once had bees in a small garden, they used to fly straight up it to a crop on the other side of the road, anyone in their way was pinged and eventually stung if they didn't run fast enough. Then I moved them to an out apiary, years later I moved and had one hive down the garden behind trees, never got stung in eighteen years. Now I live on the side of a mountain, the bees face out from the hill and they are always above my head height and are rarely a problem. If your bees persist then surround them with eight foot posts and wind netting, you can buy it cheap from garden wholesales. Once above your head height I think you will find the problem is lessened, however, I would be looking for an out apiary site by now! It may be the only way, it is no good having bees in your garden if you can't use the garden!
E

 

[YorkshireBees]

Rob, I once had bees in a small garden, they used to fly straight up it to a crop on the other side of the road, anyone in their way was pinged and eventually stung if they didn't run fast enough. Then I moved them to an out apiary, years later I moved and had one hive down the garden behind trees, never got stung in eighteen years. Now I live on the side of a mountain, the bees face out from the hill and they are always above my head height and are rarely a problem. If your bees persist then surround them with eight foot posts and wind netting, you can buy it cheap from garden wholesales. Once above your head height I think you will find the problem is lessened, however, I would be looking for an out apiary site by now! It may be the only way, it is no good having bees in your garden if you can't use the garden!
E

Sage advice indeed!
Never tried the netting myself but moving them to out apiaries was imho the best thing I ever did.

 

[BeeJayBee]

... one of the bees yesterday started to pursue my wife ...

- I have washed my protective suit in a non-perfumed washing powder to see whether that makes a difference. Possibly two inspections in 2 days didn't help...

An outside chance, probably a very outside chance, but a new detergent can make a lot of difference to how bees react to people - and your wife probably won't have been wearing a bee suit. Same with deodorant, scent, shampoo, conditioner - loads of things have smells that we like, but bees react badly to.

 

[REDWOOD]

Egg cartons, sulfite pulp

 

[psafloyd]

Not sure what is up with mine but we have to be careful when we venture out of the house.... My first brood inspection was on Saturday and I noticed then that they seemed very restless. Since then a few have been on a vendetta to sting any form of life (me, my wife and the dogs) when we go anywhere their area. The other colony is fine. My fear is that something has happened to the queen and this has changed their demeanor. They are bringing in a lot of OSR, so this may have something too do with it, but it makes it difficult to live near them at the moment. Waiting for it all to die down.

Aside from annoying them by going in too often, consider the weather. Sometimes I know a thunderstorm is coming hours before there are any visible signs. They are tetchy in a way they are not usually, so I retreat and go back another time when they are back to normal.

When they are busy, you may be disturbing them, but it may not be them. YOu are new and perhaps your bedside manner needs work, especially if you are getting tense or nervous.

Move slowly and calmly (but purposefully) and try not to bang them about too much. That, as sure as eggs is eggs, will piss them off. Some have tried clove oil to get them to move away from your hands. It is effective to a point –-put a rag in a jar and drop some oil of cloves on and seal the lid. Then rub your hands on it before inspection. It can help, if only as a placebo (used it on one nervous character) and they were far less clumsy.

Also, if you have aftershave, strong deodorant, soap, or just stink, will set them off. Oh, and they don't like onion breath after a summer's ploughman's.
Have some mints with you and they will hardly notice you if you're breathing on them to expose the comb.