Extraction issues

[flemage]

Well I finally did it........ in my third year I have taken some honey!

I have an older radial extractor I think it was from swinty originally? It has a white motor and the only sticker which I can read leads me to a German stainless steel manufacture.

Any way I was extracting 10 frames national deeps (brood sized), and two of the frames bust, the first one there was bits of frame wood all over the place, the second it just bust the comb out of the frame. Not sure if it makes a difference but this was at different times during the extraction.

I was advised to operate the machine by putting it on half speed one way first then to go flat out the other direction then go flat out in the first direction. Also to balance the frames within the cage.

Does this happen a lot or am I doing it wrong? Hopefully in the future I wont be using deeps but that’s what I had at this time.

However I still have a bucket full of honey, its just that the strainer has had its work cut out with all the wax etc.

Thanks

 

[Travelator]

It's very common for combs to fall apart if you spin them too fast. Don't worry! You'll soon work out the right speed to use by trial and error.

Increasing the speed gradually and turning the frames over a couple of times works for me.

 

[fiftyjon]

I have a radial extractor and I spin it slowly in both directions first before whizzing up to full speed. I increase the speed until I can see that the honey starts to spin out and then leave it at that speed for a short time before changing direction. Once I think the majority of the honey has been spun out I will leave it running at full speed for a few minutes in both directions.

If you have comb that has pollen or even granulated honey then can cause it to be unbalanced and then a comb could disintegrate, sometimes a little patience and care can keep comb in one piece.

 

[flemage]

right, noted, both directions on low speed till it come out, then only move to warp speed when all but empty.

Thanks for the info

 

[Ely]

Congratulations on your first honey. I have a super on and the middle frames are just starting to get capped. The outer frames aren't yet drawn. How long can capped frames be left before you run the risk of them crystalising? I'm not sure if there is any OSR in them but I can definetely spell dandilion

 

[thedaidai]

Have you thought about moving the capped frames to the outside and bringing the outer ones into the middle,, so everything is ready to extract at the same time?

 

[flemage]

Congratulations on your first honey. I have a super on and the middle frames are just starting to get capped. The outer frames aren't yet drawn. How long can capped frames be left before you run the risk of them crystalising? I'm not sure if there is any OSR in them but I can definetely spell dandilion

Thanks, big mile stone for me....... that honey i recon it must be worth £100 per jar!!!!

i think that normal honey can be left capped with no issues at all, its the OSR thats the problem that needs to come off when frame is about a third capped or even before which was the reason for me extracting now.

 

[Ely]

Thanks, big mile stone for me....... that honey i recon it must be worth £100 per jar!!!!

i think that normal honey can be left capped with no issues at all, its the OSR thats the problem that needs to come off when frame is about a third capped or even before which was the reason for me extracting now.

I'm not next to any fields of OSR but you never know where they have been or what honey it is.

I haven't rearranged the honey frames, I didn't know whether or now that would hassle the bees

 

[flemage]

Not sure how you could tell for deffinate if its OSR. my hives are right in it so if its not OSR then i would want to know why not.

Perhaps try looking at the pollen, from what i have seen when the bees bring in it its bright yellow like the flowers of OSR but when its been on the frame a while it goes kind of greeny yellow.

any one else know how to find if it is OSR honey?

 

[herefordshirehoney]

Look at it under the microscope but you need a good one for this

 

[herefordshirehoney]

Actually thinking about that does anybody do this with the cheap lidl £20 usb microscope and is it good enough to see the pollen like OSR?

 

[itma]

For many pollens you need 800x (or greater) magnification.
I think that is beyond most 'laptop-required' magnifiers.


/ but your question would be better in the microscopy section rather than on an extraction thread!

 

[oliver90owner]

Boys and girls! Radial extraction is not directional. Some extractors only turn in one direction.

 

[itma]

Boys and girls! Radial extraction is not directional. Some extractors only turn in one direction.

Yes, there has been some confused advice.

When the frames are tangential, (and you are only extracting one side of the frame at a time), you need to turn the frames round, as you are working, because the comb won't be strong enough to support all the honey on the 'inwards' side.
Start very gently, flip them over, go gently then more strongly, flip again, spin again and hopefully you are finished.

However, with the combs mounted radially, the direction of rotation should be irrelevant.
And, you don't need to fiddle with the frames.

A motorised extractor taking 10 brood frames radially must be an impressive toy.
Not quite so sure about accidentally having that many deep frames to extract!

I'd suggest that too much speed, too quickly, sounds like the problem.
// Bigger combs need to be treated more carefully. They would need to be well drawn, and well anchored to the frame all round. And probably uncapped more symmetrically about the comb centreline.
Patience in beekeeping!

 

[flemage]

However, with the combs mounted radially, the direction of rotation should be irrelevant.
And, you don't need to fiddle with the frames.

A motorised extractor taking 10 brood frames radially must be an impressive toy.
Not quite so sure about accidentally having that many deep frames to extract!

Well its a 20 frame extractor but from the looks of it would take 12 brood frames. Unfortunately one of our number passed on, and it was sold on to me. After waiting 3 years for the 'right' extrator at the 'right' money which never happend I thought that this would cover any thing and it was once again time to stick hand in pocket and lie to wife!

I have 3 hives on doubles and these were the outer frames into which they had stored OSR and I didn’t want it crystallising in there.

So from what you are saying I don’t need to go in the other direction at all just go slowly up the speeds in the same way.

right ok thanks that makes life easier.

 

[YorkshireBees]

It tried both directions but as Rab says it makes no difference for a radial extractor.

Patience when extracting is the key. I used to crank up the speed far too early, luckily I never had a frame blow out on me yet!

Now I start as slow as possible and as soon as I see honey hitting the sides of the extractor I leave it at that speed for something like 5mins or until you can't see much more honey coming out. Only then do I steadily increase the speed in increments repeating the procedure. It does take time but so long as you balanced the frames in the extractor you can go and uncap the next lot whilst waiting!

 

[VEG]

you will get used to what speed to use as you do more extracting.

 

[Ely]

Does honey production go on hold when you do an A/S? I have a super on each. Both a third full

 

[oliver90owner]

Does honey production go on hold when you do an A/S?

Not particularly if you follow Padgen.

Roundabouts and swings. Wax has a 'honey' cost and the queen may be off-lay for a day or few, but those bees would not be foraging for about 6 weeks and there may not be a flow on then... More surplus stores collected while the bees are not feeding larvae is another small trade-off.

Draw yourself a flow diagram and insert your assessment for the different phases and you will understand it better than asking on the forum.

Losing a swarm is a far, far worse situation as regards honey crop

RAB

 

[Ely]

Thanks. A funny thing happened this afternoon. I did another artificial swam but due to lack of equipment I had to use a nuc. Despite the queen being in the nuc the returning foragers decided they'd rather be accepted into the neighbouring hives.