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Karol 

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This is what I mean about a sensible conversation I’ve never said lower husbandry standards. Could you not maintain standards and include a chlorine wash.
Not in my opinion. There are two overwhelming problems with chlorine treated poultry. First the treatment interferes with accurate microbiological testing for bacteria meaning that infected meat which should be destroyed enters the food chain because the testing fails to detect the presence of harmful pathogens. The second is that permitting chlorine treatment potentially opens a pandoras box in respect of differentiating poultry reared under best practice high standards and poultry raised under poor hygeinic standards. This would just create conditions for a race to the bottom.


You say it’s not perfect but in the real world little is, even the current vaccines we are pinning our hopes on are not perfect! Surely this would reduce the instances of infection you’ve seen.
What keeps infection rates down is high food standards where you don't need chlorine treatment because it adds no benefit which is where we are/were but are at risk of HMG sacrificing to save economic face.

So if that was the case are you for it? As for being not inclusive and in some kind of ivory tower because i said I care about what I consume, that’s total balls. You’ve just suggested that caring is only open to those who can afford it. How very inclusive of you, how’s your tower! It matters not a jot your income you can still care and take pride in what you consume and many do. Food standards have a cost the sensible thing is to find a balance that is good for the product/animals and is affordable to all. Much the same as beekeepers complain about those under valuing honey and selling for a few £ but then not sure you keep bees so you may not understand that. Ian
Well perhaps a little more care with how you word things might help to avoid sending the wrong message:

"People have a choice with food be informed and take your pick pay the price, or as some do turn a blind eye and don’t think how you can get a chicken for a couple of £"
 

CaptainCymru 

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Swerving slightly away from trying to iron out a few wrinkles in Brexit , has anyone watched rotten on Netflix?
 
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ericbeaumont 

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Swarm 

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Free unhindered access for all trading from NI to rest of UK, according to Question time. There you go it's just been mentioned again.
 

ericbeaumont 

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But what about livestock?
.gov doesn't refer to livestock but animals and insects and so on, and the single mention of bees excludes them as animals.

The page https://www.gov.uk/guidance/importing-or-moving-live-animals-animal-products-and-high-risk-food-and-feed-not-of-animal-origin#import-non-harmonized-animals-such-as-reptiles-amphibians-except-salamanders-and-invertebrates-except-bees-molluscs-and-crustaceans suggests it's complicated:

Import non-harmonized animals such as reptiles, amphibians (except salamanders) and invertebrates (except bees, molluscs and crustaceans)
Imports of non-harmonized animals such as reptiles, amphibians (except salamanders) and invertebrates (except bees, molluscs and crustaceans) must be:
  • pre-notified by the importer using IPAFFS one working day in advance of arrival at the point of entry
  • accompanied by the relevant commercial documents - including an invoice and packing list containing details of species, number of animals, premises of origin and premises of destination
  • accompanied by an exporter declaration that the animals are ‘fit to travel’ for commercial moves
There is a specific mention of insects further down that page:

Check if you need to notify APHA
You need to notify APHA if you plan to import live animals that do not need a health certificate or official documentation, but do have to be notified under Trade in Animals and Related Products regulations (TARP). For example, insects, reptiles and amphibians.

If you’re importing to NI, contact DAERA for advice about what you need to do.


Another paragraph states:

Movements from NI to GB
You can move animals, animal products and HRFNAO from NI to GB if they are qualifying NI goods.

Qualifying NI goods are goods:

  • in free circulation in NI - which means they are not under customs supervision (except when that supervision arises from the goods being taken out of NI or the EU)
  • which have undergone processing operations in NI under the inward processing procedure, and only incorporate inputs which were in free circulation in the UK
These arrangements will not apply to goods covered by specific rules such as Convention on International Trade in Endangered Species of Wild Fauna and Flora (CITES).

Outcome may rest on the definition of bees; as they are not defined as animals it looks straightforward, but if they are classed as insects then APHA must be notified.

Best piece is at the end: Contact APHA’s Centre for International Trade Carlisle if you’re not sure about anything.



 

Murox 

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Yes the UK certainly knows how to encourage smuggling, just like the old days 60's , 70's and before that. Maybe its a cunning plan!
 

pargyle 

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Pocket perhaps, bra, er no!
Oh ... I don't know ... I could see a nice little market for those less well endowed ladies suddenly becoming 44B's ... you could keep a lot of queens warm in a couple of serious falsies ... what would be the noun for a a Bee Smuggler ? If they were blonde ... Brabee ?
 

jenkinsbrynmair 

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Too many - but not nearly enough
Yes the UK certainly knows how to encourage smuggling, just like the old days 60's , 70's and before that. Maybe its a cunning plan!
I can forsee a lot of day trippers crossing the channel with queens in their pocket/bras etc 🤣🤣🤣
I can see a promotion in this for me, even advising on a new unit.
 

Erichalfbee 

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From John Getty this morning
 

E&MBees 

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From John Getty this morning
That’s good. Not sure I’m ready for bra-bee smuggling yet!!
 

Apple 

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.gov doesn't refer to livestock but animals and insects and so on, and the single mention of bees excludes them as animals.

The page https://www.gov.uk/guidance/importing-or-moving-live-animals-animal-products-and-high-risk-food-and-feed-not-of-animal-origin#import-non-harmonized-animals-such-as-reptiles-amphibians-except-salamanders-and-invertebrates-except-bees-molluscs-and-crustaceans suggests it's complicated:

Import non-harmonized animals such as reptiles, amphibians (except salamanders) and invertebrates (except bees, molluscs and crustaceans)
Imports of non-harmonized animals such as reptiles, amphibians (except salamanders) and invertebrates (except bees, molluscs and crustaceans) must be:
  • pre-notified by the importer using IPAFFS one working day in advance of arrival at the point of entry
  • accompanied by the relevant commercial documents - including an invoice and packing list containing details of species, number of animals, premises of origin and premises of destination
  • accompanied by an exporter declaration that the animals are ‘fit to travel’ for commercial moves
There is a specific mention of insects further down that page:

Check if you need to notify APHA
You need to notify APHA if you plan to import live animals that do not need a health certificate or official documentation, but do have to be notified under Trade in Animals and Related Products regulations (TARP). For example, insects, reptiles and amphibians.

If you’re importing to NI, contact DAERA for advice about what you need to do.


Another paragraph states:

Movements from NI to GB
You can move animals, animal products and HRFNAO from NI to GB if they are qualifying NI goods.

Qualifying NI goods are goods:

  • in free circulation in NI - which means they are not under customs supervision (except when that supervision arises from the goods being taken out of NI or the EU)
  • which have undergone processing operations in NI under the inward processing procedure, and only incorporate inputs which were in free circulation in the UK
These arrangements will not apply to goods covered by specific rules such as Convention on International Trade in Endangered Species of Wild Fauna and Flora (CITES).

Outcome may rest on the definition of bees; as they are not defined as animals it looks straightforward, but if they are classed as insects then APHA must be notified.

Best piece is at the end: Contact APHA’s Centre for International Trade Carlisle if you’re not sure about anything.
Honey bees in ENGLAND are defined as food producing stock.
 
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