Discouraging Bees from nesting in bird boxes

[mike696]

Hello,

Apologies if this has been posted in the wrong section of the forum.
I have nothing against bees, quite the opposite, my garden is planted up specifically with native wildflowers to try and do my bit for them.
But I was hoping someone might be able to suggest ways to discourage bees/wasps from nesting in bird boxes? I have a large 8 chamber Swift box which due to its size and height from the ground (7m) cannot be removed, so I'm eager to try and prevent this from happening. I close the entrances when the Swifts leave between August and April which must help, but wondered if there is anything else which could be done to make it less desirable during the period they are left open?
Are there any natural repellents which could be placed inside the box or next to the entrances which might help?

I'd greatly appreciate any advice people could give.

Many thanks

Michael

 

[Heather]

Totally clean out each winter, bees love old nests.
I had one in my bird box (forgot to empty) so I gently transferred to an Apidea about 1' away. Now use for teaching purposes on Joe Public days.

 

[Davelin]

This is probably the wrong forum to ask about discouraging bees!!

If you get bees in your box they are most likely to be bumble bees which are every bit as important as the birds you hope to attract.

Why would you want to discourage them?

 

[Summerslease]

The bumble bee which likes to nest in bird boxes is Bombus hypnorum, the Tree Bumble Bee (a recent arrival in the UK). The best way to discourage them from your swift box I think would be to cover the entrance with Duct Tape. Swift arrival dates are fairly fixed and I don't think the bee inhabits occupied boxes.

 

[theeggman]

Sorry Michael ,

I can't help with your problem, but you've come to right place.

Bees in their different species need all the help they can get.

Tim.

 

[mike696]

Thanks for the replies so far. Fortunately Swifts use very little nest material, so hopefully that will be a benefit.

Davelin, as I said I have no problem with bees, just preferably not in my Swift box - they can cause the Swifts to desert. Removing them would be difficult because the box can't be removed and it's at a height I wouldn't fancy dealing with bee's at! Hence the desire to look for a method of preventing it.

I've put up other boxes which are left open all year to try and give them another option should they wish to.

Any other thoughts?

 

[victor meldrew]

The tree bumble bee can be a little defensive , unlike others I can dive bomb anyone approaching the nest !


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

 

[bontbee]

hi Mike696,

I think it's fab you are providing nest sites for swifts - one of my favourite birds - and for me it's they that mark the summer, not swallows.

Are wasps and bees frequently a problem?(do you get honey bee swarms in an 8 chamber box??? it sounds massive...) Do you have any views on wood v. fibre-crete boxes?

thanks

 

[YorkshireBees]

The bumble bee which likes to nest in bird boxes is Bombus hypnorum, the Tree Bumble Bee (a recent arrival in the UK). The best way to discourage them from your swift box I think would be to cover the entrance with Duct Tape. Swift arrival dates are fairly fixed and I don't think the bee inhabits occupied boxes.

Not only the tree bumble bee.

I removed a bird nest box last year for a member of the public who was too worried that the bumbles would attack their young children! Despite all the reassurance I could give I gently removed the box at night and transferred it to my back garden.

This year I have a new lot of bumbles occupying it!

They are black / yellow with a white bum and the workers are very small.

 

[mike696]

Hi Bontbee,

I'd provide a link to the box - but the forum wont let me add them yet because I'm a new member.

If you google the 'Action for Swifts' blog and type in Michael Osborne's Swift Hotel in the very top left hand corner of the screen it will take you to a page where its featured.

I've not had problems with bees as of yet, but others have with Swift boxes. Honey bees in particular. Perhaps because the boxes are larger than most tit boxes and Swifts use very little nesting material?

My box is made from marine Ply but I like the woodcrete material, as it has very good weather resistance and insulation properties.

 

[richardbees]

Mike

good luck....swifts are probably more endangered than bees.

 

[user 6228]

to discourage bees make the entrances > 20 cm^2 in area

 

[Erichalfbee]

Yes, good luck. I miss the swifts since we moved here.When I lived in London there were many. There were a few in Lampeter last year.
The first year we had a swift box in Cumbria......swift box tunes on iPod into a speaker...... we got starlings but the next year was a success.
What a bird.....wonderful. I am amazed at how the babies are just "abandoned" and leave the nest on their own.

 

[Finman]

.
I have had 20 years bees and 18 Swift nests in my cottage yard. I have never seen that bees or bumblebees disturb Swift.
But squirrel and woodbecker eate Youngs of swift and some year only two nest get adult Youngs.

The cavity of the nest is small. Nest cup is 10 cm diameter. If the cavity of bottom is bigger, eggs drop easily away from shallow nest cup.

TO encourage bees and wasps...there is no such way.

By the way. Swift cleans itss mest so well that is like done with vacuum. Them it get som stuff and glues the best cup with saliva.

What I have learned is that the bortom OF nest cannot be ply. The Bird is not able to handle that surface and make the nest cup. Eggs will be crushed on the ply.

In the Bird box the distance from entrance to bottom must be 40 cm. Them Swift is satisfied. The entrance hole should be 50 mm

 

[Finman]

. I am amazed at how the babies are just "abandoned" and leave the nest on their own.

What I have followed them 30 y, they are never abandoned. Bady development time is slow. From egg laying TO leave the nest it takes 2,5 months.
When 2 eggs are hatched, Another parent quards the Babies at least 2 weeks and them I can see that boath Catch food TO Babies. The is no such bad Weather that parents abandon their Babies alone over night. They ARE shouting in the box Every morning Before they start TO fly.

Sory for my smart phone text...it invents ITS own style

 

[bontbee]

Hi Bontbee,

I'd provide a link to the box - but the forum wont let me add them yet because I'm a new member.

If you google the 'Action for Swifts' blog and type in Michael Osborne's Swift Hotel in the very top left hand corner of the screen it will take you to a page where its featured.

I've not had problems with bees as of yet, but others have with Swift boxes. Honey bees in particular. Perhaps because the boxes are larger than most tit boxes and Swifts use very little nesting material?

My box is made from marine Ply but I like the woodcrete material, as it has very good weather resistance and insulation properties.

Thanks Mike, - and Finman,

Just had a look at the site and at a volume of about 27l these boxes are on the smaller end of the "acceptable range", and an entrance hole of 38cm2 is way too big...if you believe what you read about honey bees' preferences, (and my very shaky arithmetic is correct).

I know that bees are not fond of the smell of thymol: one of the treatments we use against the varroa mite contains, essentially, thyme oil. When it is put on the hive, lots of bees within a colony retreat out of the front door and cluster together in the fresh-er air. I quite understand why, too; it is very, very pungent in the form we use. You can smell a colony that's being treated some distance off on a calm day. It's probably not something you'd want to try on swifts when you're trying to entice them...how's their sense of smell?

On the other hand, quite a few people on the forum use another essential oil, lemongrass, to attract swarms, so don't try that one! I'm sure other forum members will let you know of any other attractants.

may I ask if these boxes are prototypes, or have they proved to be successful? It'd be good to know what is available for anyone considering a new build and who can see further than their own needs. Though this, and a whole lot of other "mitigations" should be part of the planning system. (when hell freezes over, no doubt). ooops, off on one... sorry Mike.

 

[Erichalfbee]

What I have followed them 30 y, they are never abandoned. Bady development time is slow. From egg laying TO leave the nest it takes 2,5 months.
When 2 eggs are hatched, Another parent quards the Babies at least 2 weeks and them I can see that boath Catch food TO Babies. The is no such bad Weather that parents abandon their Babies alone over night. They ARE shouting in the box Every morning Before they start TO fly.

Sory for my smart phone text...it invents ITS own style

I didn't mean abandoned in that way. The parents leave when the time is right and the youngsters follow in two days or so. They are independent immediately and do not need to be supported by their parents after fledging. I think they are wonderful birds and I have always been fascinated by them.

 

[Finman]

.
It took 10 years from me TO understand what is ideal hive TO Swift. After trial and error.

Swift reacts on Odd odors in birdbox. If the hive has odor of mouse, Bird Will not accept the box. If there is allready a sterling nest, swift goes in and destroy s the sterling Babies.

 

[mike696]

Thanks for everyone's suggestions

Erichalfbee, I agree Swifts are fascinating creatures. To think the young which fledge the nest then live entirely on the wing for 2-3 years, only touching down again to breed for the first time.

Bontbee, thanks for your suggestions, that was just the sort of information I was looking for. Like you mentioned, it's difficult finding a solution which wouldn't affect the swifts too. Is there anything which could be put on the ceiling of the boxes which would prevent bees from building their honeycombs?

On the topic of boxes, the 8 chamber box is my own design but there are plenty of commercial external/internal boxes available which swifts are also known to accept. Schwegler produces a range. Another tried and tested design is the Zeist box which is simple to make. I'm with you Bontbee, I can't believe housing developers aren't made to include nestbricks in new builds these days.

Mike

 

[Midland Beek]

How did I miss this thread? Fascinating. As much as I like bees, I haven't seen a swift in my district for over a decade.

Heather already said it, but a lot of bumble bees are attracted by the smell of mouse, ie. they nest where mice have nested. So I wonder if mice nest in those boxes after the Swifts have left?

Tree nesting bumble bees are quite defensive and if they have already taken up residence they might be difficult for a swift to shift.