Bees swarmed no sign of queen what do I do?

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newbe

New Bee
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Jun 10, 2012
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Location
Isle of Wight
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National
Number of Hives
3
Hi
3 weeks ago my bees swarmed ( 19th May) To prevent secondary swarming I was advised to split the hive in 2 ( 22nd May) I took the second hive with the strongest queen cell, brood, stores and bees to a different location. How long do I wait before I check on it?

I opened up the original hive yesterday 3 weeks after swarming and found there were no eggs, most of the brood had hatched. I could not see the queen, there were plenty of pollen,honey and a lot of bees. The brood had been cleaned out.

How long does it take for the queen to lay eggs? Should I buy a new queen?
 
All the brood in the original hive will have hatched. You say you left a queen cell in the second hive, did you leave any in the original? I think you should try a test frame in the original hive before buying a new queen just to make sure you dont have a queen in there already. I'm sure a more experienced beek will come along shortly to give you more advice.
 
Tell us more precisely what you found and did at the time. May have been good, may have been disasterous for the colonies. Can't tell without some detail.

For a start you need to check that moved hive, particularly if the cell was recently capped when the hive was moved.

Too late now, if things went wrong. Your first check should have been after two or three days! You may have anything from a good queen to a small scrubby one, to none at all.
 
After the swarm (sat 19th) I checked the hive and found there were eggs, larvae, brood,pollen & honey no sign of a queen but there were 2 queen cells capped off.
On 22nd I rang the man I bought them from who advised me to split the hive in two to prevent secondary swarming.
We opened up the hive and removed 2 frames of brood 2 frames of stores and shook 3 frames of bees into a new hive with a queen cell. Sealed up the hive and took this to a location over 1 mile away as advised.The queen cell in the hive that has been moved was capped off on the inspection on the19th May. Haven't checked this one yet due to bad weather but hope to do this tomorrow if the weather allows.
The original hive was also left with a queen cell in it. We were advised to leave it 10 -14 days before checking. Checked 14 days later no eggs, checked again yesterday 18 days later.
There are 2 frames of stores 2 of cleaned out brood cell with pollen and honey. There is a handful of drone brood to hatch.
 
There is a handful of drone brood left to hatch. Yes we left 1 queen cell in the original hive. I cant try a test frame as we do not have any brood.
 
Did you see any sign of the queen cell in todays inspection.

If so how did it look, did it have a nice slightly perforate hole at the end.

When you shook the bees into the moved hive did you shake the frame with the queen cell.
 
Hi
In yesterdays inspection there were 4 queen caps nothing in them.
No we placed the frame with the queen cell very gently in to the new hive and shook the bees in from other frames
 
the original capped off cell has gone ,but there are 4 queen cups with nothing in them.
 
That’s ok the queen cups mean nothing and the fact that the original QC had gone is not so surprising the bees often remove them but sometimes they can be there for a while.

Personally I would give them one more week and go and check the split asap.

I don’t know the size of the hive after it swarmed and I assume you lost the swarm but to me the advice to split the hive is ok if you wanted increase but moving the other hive with a sealed QC is a risk.

The weather has not been great and this next week also unsettled and the queen if present may not have been able to get out on mating flight.
 
Ok I will do that
The hive originally contained 11 frames 9 in use after the swarm we were down to about 7 frames, yeah we lost the swarm.
If there is no sign of a queen in the original hive in a weeks time do I get another queen? Or will it be too late?
 
OK, so now you have two nucleus sized colonies, hopefully with queens, Unless you have access to a couple of test frames you have little option other than to be patient and wait for one or the other to start laying, hopefully worker brood. When that happens (capped worker brood) you could take a test frame for your other colony, if required.

There would be a high risk to introduce a new queen to either of them until you are very sure there is not a resident queen - your new queen would be killed.

You need to proceed carefully and consider your options as they arise. You should get at least one good queen from the remains of your original colony, hopefully.

While waiting, get a good beekeeping book and study it. Hooper would do.

I hope you intend to increase to two colonies - you would find it so much easier to manage two colonies, and with very little extra input (you can lose a swarm and still get out of it relatively unscathed). Losing swarms is not good, however, for most situations.
 
I will be patient and wait and keep my fingers crossed that she is there and will lay soon.
I intend to have 2 colonies if they have been successful. Thank you for your help
 
Patience may well be the answer. I have just waited from 02.05. to 06.06 from hatching for a virgin to come in to lay magnificently.

As I saw polished cells ready and waiting I was pretty sure she would lay.

Cazza
 
Good news there are eggs in the hive that was moved!!! My other half did a very quick inspection this morning before the heavy rain set in. He saw queen cups, all brood had hatched. Ants had made an nest on top of the crown board!!!!
At the weekend we will have a thorough inspection for the queen and also check the other hive to see if there are any eggs.
 
It is very unusual to be totally queenless.

Use a test frame to check the status as most lost bought in queens are lost as they are introduced to colonies with virgins.

Remember the recent weather has not been helpful for matings.

PH
 
Good news there are eggs in the hive that was moved!!! My other half did a very quick inspection this morning before the heavy rain set in. He saw queen cups, all brood had hatched. Ants had made an nest on top of the crown board!!!!
At the weekend we will have a thorough inspection for the queen and also check the other hive to see if there are any eggs.
 
At the weekend we will have a thorough inspection for the queen

Err, why?

Leave her in peace to get on with the job of laying. Further interference at this time is not needed! You know she is there, or was, less than three days ago.

You will gain precisely nothing by searching for her and possiby cause further trouble (dead queens don't lay eggs!).

You now have to wait until some brood is capped, to check if it is worker brood. You have about three weeks to find her should you wish to clip or mark her (there will be fewer bees then and also, hopefully, there will be more out foraging. Further, by then you will know the status of your other colony and can make a sensible decision as to when or if to mark her, or whatever.

Please follow the advice in Para 4, post #10 in the meantime. Beekeping is so easy when you know what they are going to do or what they need doing.

RAB
 
We opened up the original hive on sunday and found 1 day old eggs so both hives are ok at present!!!
 
Patience may well be the answer. I have just waited from 02.05. to 06.06 from hatching for a virgin to come in to lay magnificently.

As I saw polished cells ready and waiting I was pretty sure she would lay.

Cazza

That's something like 5 weeks. I thought all was lost after 3 weeks?

After a swarm and cast swarm I now have 2 hives and a nuc (I had one hive previously!) Spotted a queen in the nuc on Monday but couldn't see any others though there were plenty of bees in the 2 hives. I saw 0 eggs :( My theoretical cut off date for eggs in the nuc and one of the hives is Monday next and 8-11 days later for the other hive. Sounds however like there may in fact be more time available for laying to begin?

I also noticed loads of highly polished cells and was assuming this was a fairly positive indicator. Fingers crossed...
 

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