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Apiguard overdose?

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keithgrimes 

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I've read on the apiguard box that it is possible to overdose bees, resulting in deaths. I am starting to treat this weekend and have one nuc box with three frames (I am going to combine later when I have more brood). Would you reduce the dose of Apiguard? I am thinking of removing half the gel from the tray but not sure of that would reduce the thymol concentration in the nuc???
 

Hebeegeebee 

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1/2 dose for nucs. Then in 2 weeks put on the other half (keep it in a bag or something).
 

oliver90owner 

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You will likely see them 'hanging out the door', before absconding! Yes it could conceivably kill the colony - all thymol treatments (as well as others) need to be applied with care and consideration towards the bees. The instructions should be clear, otherwise contact the distributors or manufacturers.

Regards, RAB
 

barratt_sab 

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Does anyone have any information or views on using Apiguard whilst feeding syrup with thymol in it?

Vita tell me that each 50g of Apiguard contains 12.5g of thymol.

If I’ve read it correctly, Hivemaker’s recipe would give about 1g of thymol per gallon for treatment or 0.3g for syrup preservation.

So, a two-tray Apiguard treatment would introduce 25g of thymol and feeding a gallon of autumn syrup would add another 1g at most.

Given the inherently variable doseage rate of Apiguard, I find it hard to imagine that a 4% increase in thymol would be a problem, but does anyone know better?

I have asked Vita too, and will post any response.
 

The Riviera Kid 

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i have put two apiguard in at the same time - don't know what I was thinking...

will this harm them then? when they have cleared out the trays, should i put another in to continue the treatment into the next 2 weeks??
 

MJBee 

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I would take one out now, seal it in a plastic bag then give it back 14 days after you gave the first.

If you leave both in the first hot day you get will release so much thymol that the bees will suffer/die/abscond
 

MuswellMetro 

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1/2 dose for nucs. Then in 2 weeks put on the other half (keep it in a bag or something).
agree, half dose

i alway wonder if one and a half apiguards tubs should be used in brood & Half or 14x12 broods

Does any one increase the dosage for 14x12 etc
 

Hivemaker. 

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4. Q: Can I use Apiguard with a brood and a half or a double brood ?
A: Yes, but bear in mind that the level of mite control may be slightly lower than
with a single brood chamber, as the number of bees that need to receive treatment is
higher. Most bees, brood and varroa will usually be in the lower brood chamber; place
the Apiguard on top of the brood frames of the lower chamber and put the second
brood chamber on top (ie the Apiguard is between the brood boxes). Repeat after 2
weeks, following Point 2 above.

http://www.vita-europe.com/en/APIGUARD FAQs 2009.pdf
 

wightbees 

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Does thymol kill the mites or just make them drop off?
 

bobandbec 

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Where I have doubles I put tray on top of top BB. Hasn't caused a problem yet. I do also use OA in Winter.

Peter
 

dolbz 

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Any suggestions for colonies mid way between nuc and full brood box? They're well over half way. About 7.5 frames of bees. about 6 of them very densely populated.

I put a full tray on today as according to the instructions just a single dosage is required. On second reading now though that might indicate a single dosage over the 4 weeks...

Q: I want to treat nucs with Apiguard. What dose should I use?
A: To treat nuclei or small/weak colonies treat with only 1 x 25g Apiguard – no more than this. For small nuclei reduce this to half again (1 x 12.5g approx). Small (e.g. less than 5 frames) or weak colonies may not tolerate a 50g Apiguard dose and brood may be removed by the workers. If brood removal is seen, remove the product from the colony.
 

oliver90owner 

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It's possibly the size of the box, as well as the size of the colony. A nuc sized colony in the Albert hall might need more than one tray of apiguard!( just as an exteeeeme).

Regards, RAB
 

dolbz 

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Ah good point RAB. I think I'll leave them with the full tray then and see how they're coping next week. *crosses fingers*
 

the druggist 

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Sorry Pharmacist hat on here!

Why don't people treat drugs seriously? Apiguard is a drug, Heroin is a drug and Aspirin is a drug - all of them can KILL.

PLEASE read all instructions carefully and the read them again. Don't do anything different and if in any doubt ASK.

Just my tuppence ha'penny
 

oliver90owner 

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While I don't personally make a recommendation of what I actually use - then there is no comeback on me - I do adjust my dosages dependent on local factors, but maybe that is the chemist in me. I don't see too many instructions which show a sliding scale from nuc to a double brood. Killing mites, without affecting the bees too much, is the aim.

As a pharmacist, thedruggist (or perhaps the doctor) might well prescribe on a weight-pro-rata basis for some drugs. The instructions on most of this stuff is designed for all beekeepers - sort of 'universal'.

Regards, RAB
 

MuswellMetro 

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Any suggestions for colonies mid way between nuc and full brood box? They're well over half way. About 7.5 frames of bees. about 6 of them very densely populated.

I put a full tray on today as according to the instructions just a single dosage is required. On second reading now though that might indicate a single dosage over the 4 weeks...
I think the minimum is to have half a tub on at two week intervals, but normally on colonys like your i would use an extra half a tub in at 4 weeks

this means thymol is on for six weeks +, or nearly two cycle of brood
 

the druggist 

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I think RAB has it here, it depends on the volume you are trying to occupy with Thymol vapour. If it's a small nuc sized box then a full tray of Apiguard may be too toxic. However if it's a nuc in a fuul sized brood chamber (of a national) then you may need a full tay to occupy the space with Thymol vapour.
Have you sought advice from the manufacturer?
 

Hivemaker. 

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You also need enough for the quantity of bee's,its not just the vapour....its the bee's spreading the thymol around on there bodys.
 
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