Another 2012 queen bites the dust:-( ?

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dickndoris

House Bee
Joined
Feb 10, 2011
Messages
282
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5
Location
York
Hive Type
National
Number of Hives
35
A queen I found outside her nuc this morning. She was sat in the entrance looking pretty dead. Warmed her up in front of the stove and popped her back in. Looks like yet another poor 2012 queen. Wondering just how many colonies are going to make it to spring:-(
 
"A queen I found outside her nuc this morning."

Dont despair just yet, her daughter has more than likely taken over.
 
Dont despair just yet, her daughter has more than likely taken over.

That was my first thought, too.
 
Won't get mated for a long while though. I guess only time will tell.
 
I guess only time will tell.

If not mated now, there is approx zero probability of doing so, ever.
 
If they have ejected the old girl, then the new girl is likely to be mated and up and running already. The joys of superceedure.
 
There is no reason why a queenless colony won't make it to spring as there is zero brood to feed. With plenty of spare colonies you could combine the survivors in the spring as they will still be 'young'

As for your other postings where you were inspecting this hive and looking in open queen cells a week or two ago... words fail me!
 
There is no reason why a queenless colony won't make it to spring as there is zero brood to feed. With plenty of spare colonies you could combine the survivors in the spring as they will still be 'young'

As for your other postings where you were inspecting this hive and looking in open queen cells a week or two ago... words fail me!

Erm? Not this one but another nuc had a "sealed" QC. A choice to leave it or let the young queen come out and potentially kill the old queen which was laying with brood at all levels. Last quick inspection (of all my colonies) as it was very warm with all bees flying to check for potential problems and of course stores level. Zero drones in all colonies. When I say quick, I mean quick with most frames only checked with my fingers for weight. I be not a hands on in every five minutes kind of keeper.
Why may I ask do words fail you?
Of course they should make it through to spring, if we get one, if not then they will not, the queen will not mate. Already combined 5 colonies this summer due to poor mated queens. But then again, we didn't get one, did we?
 
I might be wrong but it sounds to me as though you have been splitting your hives heavily last year......just a tip, let them get strong before you split. It sounds like you have split and hoped for a queen to be produced and mated on more than one occasion with the same hive. It could be an answer as to why you have had a poor year. Sometimes they won't be forced into making new queens before they are ready, on my experience anyway.
If you have been producing queens in a queen rearing programme then I am sorry for misunderstanding.......just trying to understand why you have had so many failures, seems odd to me.
 
Erm? Not this one but another nuc had a "sealed" QC. A choice to leave it or let the young queen come out and potentially kill the old queen which was laying with brood at all levels.

The books say don't go in a hive unless you can comfortably walk around in shorts and a t shirt. But to a Yorkshireman (or woman) that could mean -20 deg C and a few feet of snow on the ground. So the books are wrong. But that doesn't mean poking around the hive trying to fix problems that might not exist and over which you have little control is a good idea!

If a new queen emerges in a queenright colony it either swarms or it doesn't swarm. This time of year, this far up north, with the weather we have been having, the bees won't swarm. The latest swarm I've ever had was end of August/Early September due to a (forced by circumstances) heavy feed and bees that preferred to backfill a broodbox than store in a super.

So you might end up with two queens in a hive. So what? You may get scrapping between virgins, but two queens, in a well populated hive, one mated no matter how badly and a recently emerged virgin will be kept apart. If the new one by some miracle mates and is accepted then the old one may be killed, but the old one is just as likely to be around next spring, maybe side by side on the same frame with the new queen. (Many beekeepers see one queen and never even consider looking for another)

But as the weather locally got worse and the nights got a lot colder the queen cell might have been torn down, or recently emerged new queens might have been dumped out the hive (I've seen them dumped on the roofs of hives before when bees stuck with their original queen) Bees want to survive the winter and while they may sense a queen failing and try to raise another one, they won't normally kill the old one before the new one is properly established. But having said that they can still do strange things that the beekeeper can't understand and all the books ever written never mention.

Yes I've wrote a lot for someone who said words fail me, but fiddling in a hive this far north, in October, even in a very good year, is IMHO a bad idea, with the recent conditions it's just plain daft. Let them get on with it. They might make mistakes, but they have a few million more years experience of making mistakes and getting it right than even the oldest and most experienced beekeeper.
 
I might be wrong but it sounds to me as though you have been splitting your hives heavily last year......just a tip, let them get strong before you split. It sounds like you have split and hoped for a queen to be produced and mated on more than one occasion with the same hive. It could be an answer as to why you have had a poor year. Sometimes they won't be forced into making new queens before they are ready, on my experience anyway.
If you have been producing queens in a queen rearing programme then I am sorry for misunderstanding.......just trying to understand why you have had so many failures, seems odd to me.

No splits, just finding -Q colonies that were seemingly in great shape. Test frames in and getting lots of small QC so just combined colonies. All the queens were this years, not bought in. I can only think that they just didn't get mated fully? Who knows ey:)
One thing with keeping bees, you always learn something every day and you find out that there are 50 ways to do the same thing but at different times;-)
 
Martin in Yorkshire. I read your comment and I thank you for taking he time to read and reply. Always learning. The day was warm and sunny and I did have a t shirt on, under my bee jacket but no shorts as that might be a bad idea;-) Very active bees and I'm glad I went in as 2 still needed feeding a fair amount. I know I can rest now safe in the knowledge they will not starve at least. Already had a near miss earlier on in one colony running out of food and that was leaving them to it. It's finding the level I guess........

R
By the way, was it you that gave me 2 tickets to NYMR in Deans? We had a great day out if it was, Thank you.
 
Surely you can heft

There are many who cannot do this Susbees, in fact i believe that the majority cannot do it for varying reasons,too old,too weak, obesity, or simply don't have the experiance of knowing what a hive would weigh by hefting.
 
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There are many who cannot do this Susbees, in fact i believe that the majority cannot do it for varying reasons,too old,too weak, or simply don't have the experiance of knowing what a hive would weigh by hefting.

As someone who has been running 30 Commercial hives and nucs with pretty much one arm for much of the last two years I understand this (and that's without my dominant arm)...but if it's too heavy to lift one side without effort it's surely full for the average beekeeper...
 
There are many who cannot do this

in which case they should learn!

I'm about free TV licence age and weigh my hives every winter with a spring balance which are £6 on ePay.

Do it at night with a friend (quiet there at the back!)

Block the entrance and hook the spring Balance under one edge, then gently lift until the hook is taking the weight. Your friend reads the weight on the balance, double it and you have +/- the total weight of the hive.

I expect my National BB with floor and crown board (roof removed) to weigh about 60lbs after winter feeding
 

Do it at night with a friend (quiet there at the back!)


Sounds like quite a covert operation.

I heft them in the daylight,takes just a few minutes to heft a row of say 30 hives,no friend,no spring balance...just a quick lift by hand and i know if they have enough stores or not. Its just practice thats all.
 
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Its just practice thats all.
:iagree:
Quite!

And a box of Neurofen after hefting 40 + hives !!!:icon_204-2:


but if you only have 2 hives difficult to judge!
 

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