Advice on splitting from Langstroth into 14x12 National please

[PhilN]

I took on a neglected Langstroth hive with a small swarm colony last autumn. It is now looking very active and healthy. The Hive is weighty (to the extent that I'm probably not going to add any more fondant - they've taken around 5-6kg of fondant over the winter and I fed 2:1 syrup plentifully in the autumn when they took around 10 litres). To pre-empt this colony swarming I am thinking that I will need to do a split in the future (hopefully later rather than sooner!) In spite of the temptation to, I haven't inspected beneath the crownboard - there's lots of warnings about it still being too cold which I have heeded. If needed, I will be splitting the colony into a National 14x12 brood bodied hive that I have ready and waiting (all my other kit is National and I want to move to one size). I have read Wally Shaw's 'Simple Methods of making Increase' guide - the issue I have is that the frames (Langstroth to National) obviously aren't interchangeable/compatible as far as I'm aware.
Should I just do a shook swarm (which appears to have downsides to it) or is there a better approach to migrating half the colony into a different sized hive. If so, what's it called - I can then read up on it and try to figure out what to do. I want to have a plan in place for if and when a split is necessary.
Thanks in advance for any guidance.
(I don't plan on doing anything until much warmer weather)

 

[BigAshW]

Are you intending to keep the langstroth hive?

If not you could find the queen and put her in a national brood box over a queen excluder and put that on top of the langstroth. Then use ply to close off the gaps. Then once all the brood has hatched in the bottom box remove it and melt it all down.

 

[PhilN]

Yes, the plan is to keep the Langstroth with 1/2 the colony left in it. Planning to increase it from 1 to 2 colonies

 

[Ian123]

Take some ply mark to smallest internal dimensions and largest external. Then just cut out hole. Place on top of the Lang and add 14x12. Simply wait for queen to move up and add a thin excluder.

 

[hemo]

Two different frame sizes will be a damn nuisance, before you do anything make your mind up and stick with one type of box /frame size.

 

[PhilN]

Thanks - think I'm going to need to carefully read Increase - Summary of Methods
There seem to be lots of different methods (some a bit difficult to understand for a newbeekeeper like me) but i'm sure one of the numerous methods might work - if worst comes to the worst I might set up the extra hive as a bait hive with some cut out comb fixed on National Frames and keep my fingers crossed they swarm into it - a bit risky though as a strategy (not sure it warrants being called that!)

 

[PhilN]

Two different frame sizes will be a damn nuisance, before you do anything make your mind up and stick with one type of box /frame size.

I'm planning on continuing down the National size path - the Langstroth is a 'legacy'/acquired hive - not by choice - but don't want to bin it - I'll hopefully end up with three Nationals - currently have two with colonies, the spare (and the Langstroth)

 

[PhilN]

Take some ply mark to smallest internal dimensions and largest external. Then just cut out hole. Place on top of the Lang and add 14x12. Simply wait for queen to move up and add a thin excluder.

Thanks for that - sounds fairly straightforward. What about the Langstroth once Queen has moved up - just put the CB and roof back on and let the bees make a new Queen?

 

[Tindog]

Two different frame sizes will be a damn nuisance, before you do anything make your mind up and stick with one type of box /frame size.

 

[Tindog]

Good advice

 

[oliver90owner]

KISS principle applied by Ian 123., so +1 from me.

 

[Ian123]

Thanks for that - sounds fairly straightforward. What about the Langstroth once Queen has moved up - just put the CB and roof back on and let the bees make a new Queen?

A once the brood has hatched in the Lang box just remove it, I’d imagine a little feed will help matters along and replace any stores in the Lang, 14x12 is a big box just don’t over do it. Remember to cut hole to smallest internal dimensions. So box sits on it!

 

[PhilN]

Thanks.. I’ll probably narrow the box down with ‘celotex/kingspan frames temporarily... that’s if I carry on beekeeping! (See my o