2 Nationals to the Heather, do I add more undrawn supers?

[Speybee]

This is the first time I have put hives ( one and a half brood nest) to the Heather, as a wee challenge.
They were put up there on the 16th August one honey super filled with undrawn unwired premier thin wax above QE.

I fed them 1:1 syrup on a rapid feeder but looking at them yesterday the honey super frames were all drawn and filled with liquid, all uncapped.
I stopped feeding both hives yesterday as the wax was all drawn

1) Would this be honey nectar or would it be the syrup I fed them to encourage the wax to be drawn out? How can I tell?
2) Should I stick another super of undrawn premier wax frames directly above the QE but below the honey box full of uncapped liquid?
My reasoning being if it is Heather nectar in such a short space of time, there is no harm sticking in another honey super to take advantage of any flow.
My other reasoning that if it just the 1:1 syrup they took down, then adding another honey super directly above the QE and not feeding them any syrup, they will use up the syrup above them to draw out the wax on the extra honey super.

 

[jenkinsbrynmair]

This is the first time I have put hives ( one and a half brood nest) to the Heather, as a wee challenge.
They were put up there on the 16th August one honey super filled with undrawn unwired premier thin wax above QE.

I fed them 1:1 syrup on a rapid feeder but looking at them yesterday the honey super frames were all drawn and filled with liquid, all uncapped.
I stopped feeding both hives yesterday as the wax was all drawn

1) Would this be honey nectar or would it be the syrup I fed them to encourage the wax to be drawn out? How can I tell?
2) Should I stick another super of undrawn premier wax frames directly above the QE but below the honey box full of uncapped liquid?
My reasoning being if it is Heather nectar in such a short space of time, there is no harm sticking in another honey super to take advantage of any flow.
My other reasoning that if it just the 1:1 syrup they took down, then adding another honey super directly above the QE and not feeding them any syrup, they will use up the syrup above them to draw out the wax on the extra honey super.

I'm afraid what you have is a super packed with a mix of heather and sugar syrup, they will not now empty that super of syrup to draw out another set of frames - if there is no income out there, they will just sit on the stores and not bother with the second super.
If the heather flow was any good they would draw out and fill a super in no time with no need at all for feeding 1:1, you gain nothing by feeding during a flow, the heather flow started some weeks ago that was the time to stop feeding anything. By what I'm hearing from Murray Mc Gregor's tweets the heather is already quickly slowing down in a lot of places.
The only time I would ever contemplate feeding for comb building is if I had a nuc just transferred to a full hive and was impatient of getting all the frames drawn. If there is any kind of flow on, I just leave the bees to it.

 

[Speybee]

It was a scorcher yesterday but drizzle today without the winds arriving yet.
My challenge appears to have been an epic fail, but at least I have learned something from you and that is not to feed a strong hive to draw out unwired supers in a honey box on the Heather and will take note for next year.
I am further north than Mr M and the purple has just come out to its max this week, so I would say it will slow down mid September.

One last question for you and that is should I remove this once capped for home consumption or should I now end up with one and a half brood nest then the capped mix sugar and honey nectar, no QE but the crown board over winter now?

 

[jenkinsbrynmair]

One last question for you and that is should I remove this once capped for home consumption or should I now end up with one and a half brood nest then the capped mix sugar and honey nectar, no QE but the crown board over winter now?

Up to you. Personally I wouldn't want to eat it, either leave on for winter stores or, extract and feed back, that way you have nice virgin comb to use for your summer crop next year.

 

[Speybee]

Up to you. Personally I wouldn't want to eat it, either leave on for winter stores or, extract and feed back, that way you have nice virgin comb to use for your summer crop next year.

Thanks for the advice

 

[jenkinsbrynmair]

Thanks for the advice

forgot to add - if you think that there's a chance of them filling another super, just take the sugary one off and leave them draw the other one, that way you know it's all honey.

 

[Speybee]

That solves another Wee problem I had and that was the new box of undrawn premier wax frames made this afternoon.
It’s drizzling now so will wait for a dry day coming soon Thursday? and brush the bees off the super capped or uncapped and exchange for the undrawn comb....it’s worth a punt.

 

[Erichalfbee]

That solves another Wee problem I had and that was the new box of undrawn premier wax frames made this afternoon.
It’s drizzling now so will wait for a dry day coming soon Thursday? and brush the bees off the super capped or uncapped and exchange for the undrawn comb....it’s worth a punt.

Or put the new box under the old with a clearer board underneath but do check they have stores in the brood box.

 

[Speybee]

Or put the new box under the old with a clearer board underneath but do check they have stores in the brood box.

Thanks for this idea, but I had a strange thing happen to me with one hive that ai intended to take to the Heather.
The hive had a box of capped blossom honey and I put on the clearer board to shift the bees, but the porter escapes got jammed with drones which scuppered my plan of that hive going to the Heather as I had to brush them off and they were not happy( neither was I)

After this recent experience of clearer board failure I will try the removal of the mixed syrup/ Heather super and replace by a simpler swap box of undrawn new frames.

 

[jenkinsbrynmair]

Thanks for this idea, but I had a strange thing happen to me with one hive that ai intended to take to the Heather.
The hive had a box of capped blossom honey and I put on the clearer board to shift the bees, but the porter escapes got jammed with drones which scuppered my plan of that hive going to the Heather

Take my advice - throw the porter escapes in the bin and make yourself a modified Rhombus clearer board r

 

[Speybee]

I’ve got a board called a Canadian clearer board, it came with bulky National in my wee photo.
But I don’t know if it’s easy to use. It’s got these wee red cones scattered all over it.

Now I’ve got a reason to learn how to use it.
Making up a wax frame is about my woodworking limit, and the last time I saw a rhombus was in my maths class at the school, but I am willing to give anything a try, including buying such an item, after I read up on how to use it.
So this is a contender as a purchase to replace the porter escapes which let me down recently.

Meantime I will brush the bees off the super frames, seeing there are plenty of hills around my two hives, that I can run into!

 

[MerryBee]

JBM Please enlighten me why you cut the rhombus into 2 as shown , rather than using it with a centre hole in the CB in the way intended?

 

[Erichalfbee]

I’ve got a board called a Canadian clearer board, it came with bulky National in my wee photo.
But I don’t know if it’s easy to use. It’s got these wee red cones scattered all over it.

Now I’ve got a reason to learn how to use it.
Making up a wax frame is about my woodworking limit, and the last time I saw a rhombus was in my maths class at the school, but I am willing to give anything a try, including buying such an item, after I read up on how to use it.
So this is a contender as a purchase to replace the porter escapes which let me down recently.

Meantime I will brush the bees off the super frames, seeing there are plenty of hills around my two hives, that I can run into!

I have a Canadian clearers board. I blocked up the middle hole and took away the little red cone escapes. I cut two rhombus escapes in two and put a half in each corner. It works a treat. Really fast.

 

[jenkinsbrynmair]

Making up a wax frame is about my woodworking limit, and the last time I saw a rhombus was in my maths class at the school, but I am willing to give anything a try,

Easy enough - next time (and there will be a next time) you hammer the Maisemores or Thornes mail order sales, buy a:
rhombus escape (usually about a pound and a half on sale)
An apiguard eke - usually about three quid
Apiguard ekes are easy to put together, four bits of wood, four nails, then you can either get a piece of 6mm plywood cut to size (460x460mm) and nail it on the eke
Cut the rhombus in half
drill two 20 0r 30mm holes in the board as per the picture
fix the two rhombus halves to the 'deep' side of the board.
when you want to clear the bees down, take off the supers you want to clear, put the clearier board on with the deep side downwards over the remaining hive boxes, replace the supers to be cleared, the bees will be down in the hive by the following morning

 

[Erichalfbee]

JBM Please enlighten me why you cut the rhombus into 2 as shown , rather than using it with a centre hole in the CB in the way intended?

I don’t know why JBM does it but I have gone one better And put a half in each corner. Giving the bees more exit holes makes for faster clearing.

 

[Speybee]

I have a Canadian clearers board. I blocked up the middle hole and took away the little red cone escapes. I cut two rhombus escapes in two and put a half in each corner. It works a treat. Really fast.

Can you send me a photo please if you can so I can get a better idea.
Does this type of modified Canadian/rhombus board solve my drone blocking problem that I recently had with the porter escapes?

 

[Erichalfbee]

Can you send me a photo please if you can so I can get a better idea.
Does this type of modified Canadian/rhombus board solve my drone blocking problem that I recently had with the porter escapes?

Absolutely. There are no moving parts.

 

[Speybee]

Easy enough - next time (and there will be a next time) you hammer the Maisemores or Thornes mail order sales, buy a:
rhombus escape (usually about a pound and a half on sale)
An apiguard eke - usually about three quid
Apiguard ekes are easy to put together, four bits of wood, four nails, then you can either get a piece of 6mm plywood cut to size (460x460mm) and nail it on the eke
Cut the rhombus in half
drill two 20 0r 30mm holes in the board as per the picture
fix the two rhombus halves to the 'deep' side of the board.
when you want to clear the bees down, take off the supers you want to clear, put the clearier board on with the deep side downwards over the remaining hive boxes, replace the supers to be cleared, the bees will be down in the hive by the following morning

I am going to be a right girl here......I am going to delegate this man project to Mr Speybee.....him indoors!

 

[Speybee]

Absolutely. There are no moving parts.

Moving or not moving....this is a man thing!

 

[Speybee]

I am going to have to delegate to him indoors...I know my limitations!